1 00:00:09,709 --> 00:00:12,479 - I think there's something very magical about "Dark Shadows." 2 00:00:12,579 --> 00:00:14,080 We kind of fell into it. 3 00:00:14,180 --> 00:00:18,418 I was always fascinated by those kinds of stories, 4 00:00:18,518 --> 00:00:20,620 but "Dark Shadows" evolved into something I 5 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:22,789 never really planned on. 6 00:00:22,889 --> 00:00:25,458 It's its own world. 7 00:00:25,558 --> 00:00:29,629 It's a magical world in that nothing that happens today, 8 00:00:29,729 --> 00:00:32,599 no matter when we were doing the show, ever intruded 9 00:00:32,699 --> 00:00:34,234 on the show. 10 00:00:34,334 --> 00:00:35,735 If there was a war going on, you don't know about it 11 00:00:35,835 --> 00:00:38,071 in Collinsport, Maine. 12 00:00:38,171 --> 00:00:42,075 It exists in a world of its own. 13 00:00:42,175 --> 00:00:44,778 And the key to the whole thing is 14 00:00:44,878 --> 00:00:49,215 this incredible, fantastical, magical love 15 00:00:49,315 --> 00:00:50,817 story that spans time. 16 00:01:19,412 --> 00:01:21,581 - Dan Curtis was the macabre mind 17 00:01:21,681 --> 00:01:25,685 behind "Dark Shadows," a soap opera that 18 00:01:25,785 --> 00:01:27,620 dared to infuse the daily format's 19 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:30,623 usual melodrama and romance with vampires, 20 00:01:30,723 --> 00:01:34,894 ghosts, and a brooding Gothic atmosphere. 21 00:01:34,994 --> 00:01:37,864 But during its relatively brief time on air, 22 00:01:37,964 --> 00:01:40,900 "Dark Shadows" stoked a feverish base, 23 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:47,240 which like Barnabas Collins himself, spanned generations. 24 00:01:47,340 --> 00:01:48,508 - I hate people who make lists. 25 00:01:48,608 --> 00:01:50,443 That's what I hate about the Oscars. 26 00:01:50,543 --> 00:01:51,845 All these people bring out this list 27 00:01:51,945 --> 00:01:54,147 of 400 people they want to thank. 28 00:01:54,247 --> 00:01:55,148 But I have my own list. 29 00:01:55,248 --> 00:01:56,616 It's not that long. 30 00:01:56,716 --> 00:01:59,219 I put down 10 things about Dan Curtis 31 00:01:59,319 --> 00:02:02,489 that I feel summarize the man. 32 00:02:02,589 --> 00:02:03,857 Impatient. 33 00:02:03,957 --> 00:02:05,758 Creative. - Brilliant. 34 00:02:05,859 --> 00:02:06,793 - Pragmatic. 35 00:02:06,893 --> 00:02:07,794 - Energetic. 36 00:02:07,894 --> 00:02:09,162 - Commanding. 37 00:02:09,262 --> 00:02:10,864 - A very, very strong personality. 38 00:02:10,964 --> 00:02:12,432 - Demanding. - Focused. 39 00:02:12,532 --> 00:02:13,633 - Tough. 40 00:02:13,733 --> 00:02:15,602 - Tough guy attitude. - Hard working. 41 00:02:15,702 --> 00:02:19,172 - He called it like it was. 42 00:02:19,272 --> 00:02:20,306 - Loyal. 43 00:02:20,406 --> 00:02:21,441 Dedicated. 44 00:02:21,541 --> 00:02:22,909 - Him and I got along great. 45 00:02:23,009 --> 00:02:25,678 - There was something romantic about him and something, 46 00:02:25,778 --> 00:02:26,679 something... 47 00:02:26,779 --> 00:02:27,680 dreadful. 48 00:02:27,780 --> 00:02:28,948 - Stubborn, and proud. 49 00:02:29,048 --> 00:02:32,252 - And I was terrified of him. 50 00:02:32,352 --> 00:02:35,955 - Behind all of that kind of... 51 00:02:36,055 --> 00:02:39,926 that cloak of kind of largesse and everything, 52 00:02:40,026 --> 00:02:42,395 there's this very vulnerable person. 53 00:02:42,495 --> 00:02:44,230 I was very conscious of that. 54 00:02:44,330 --> 00:02:47,200 There was this extremely vulnerable person 55 00:02:47,300 --> 00:02:48,535 behind it all. 56 00:02:48,635 --> 00:02:51,871 He couldn't have been so intuitive without it. 57 00:02:51,971 --> 00:02:54,974 But he had this stunning duality. 58 00:03:00,280 --> 00:03:02,482 - He grew up in Bridgeport, Connecticut. 59 00:03:02,582 --> 00:03:04,551 His father was a dentist. 60 00:03:04,651 --> 00:03:08,388 He really didn't talk too much about his childhood, actually. 61 00:03:08,488 --> 00:03:11,591 I think that his mother was very dear to him. 62 00:03:11,691 --> 00:03:13,927 And I think after he lost his mother, 63 00:03:14,027 --> 00:03:16,563 I never heard stories growing up about family life. 64 00:03:22,569 --> 00:03:26,673 - When he was 13, his mother died suddenly 65 00:03:26,773 --> 00:03:28,575 in the middle of a sentence to him. 66 00:03:28,675 --> 00:03:29,909 She had an aneurysm. 67 00:03:30,009 --> 00:03:32,979 - And he was right there in the car. 68 00:03:33,079 --> 00:03:35,615 And she was pulled out of the car and put on the pavement. 69 00:03:35,715 --> 00:03:38,851 And I think this was the defining factor of his life. 70 00:03:39,953 --> 00:03:42,822 - And his father didn't really know what to do with him, 71 00:03:42,922 --> 00:03:45,825 and so he got sent to boarding school for a year. 72 00:03:45,925 --> 00:03:49,629 I think he turned that really into a strength, just 73 00:03:49,729 --> 00:03:51,431 the confidence that he had on himself 74 00:03:51,531 --> 00:03:55,301 and how he just trusted himself more than he would 75 00:03:55,401 --> 00:03:56,736 trust other people's ideas. 76 00:04:01,874 --> 00:04:07,380 - My parents met at Syracuse University, in 1950, I believe. 77 00:04:07,480 --> 00:04:13,453 And after they graduated, they got married two years later. 78 00:04:13,553 --> 00:04:20,026 My mother was very creative, and my father trusted her intuition 79 00:04:20,126 --> 00:04:21,394 inherently. 80 00:04:21,494 --> 00:04:23,696 She did believe in him very much so. 81 00:04:23,796 --> 00:04:24,964 They were quite a team. 82 00:04:25,064 --> 00:04:27,367 - What really struck me in looking back 83 00:04:27,467 --> 00:04:30,570 was the incredible commitment and loyalty. 84 00:04:36,876 --> 00:04:40,079 - Shortly after moving to Chicago with his wife Norma, 85 00:04:40,179 --> 00:04:42,915 Dan began working as a salesman. 86 00:04:43,016 --> 00:04:44,717 And while he had not originally aspired 87 00:04:44,817 --> 00:04:48,354 to a career in television, one of the first jobs he landed 88 00:04:48,454 --> 00:04:49,856 was at NBC. 89 00:04:49,956 --> 00:04:51,658 - I used to be a salesman. 90 00:04:51,758 --> 00:04:55,628 I was selling syndicated junk to the local television stations. 91 00:04:55,728 --> 00:04:57,363 And they were awful. 92 00:04:57,463 --> 00:04:59,065 So I always used to say things like, "If I couldn't do it 93 00:04:59,165 --> 00:05:01,934 better than these dumb bastards, I'd give up the business." 94 00:05:02,035 --> 00:05:05,872 - He certainly never liked anybody telling him what to do. 95 00:05:05,972 --> 00:05:08,808 He didn't want to work for a network. 96 00:05:08,908 --> 00:05:11,044 And he wanted to be his own man. 97 00:05:16,749 --> 00:05:19,485 - Curtis decided the best place to launch his own production 98 00:05:19,585 --> 00:05:21,821 company was New York City. 99 00:05:22,922 --> 00:05:25,425 He and Norma made the move, but success did not 100 00:05:25,525 --> 00:05:27,393 come without a struggle. 101 00:05:29,028 --> 00:05:30,830 - I got myself a little office. 102 00:05:30,930 --> 00:05:32,765 It was a penthouse office, I called it. 103 00:05:32,865 --> 00:05:37,003 It was a storage room at the top of 119 West 57th Street. 104 00:05:37,103 --> 00:05:40,907 You had to walk out on to an outside fire escape 105 00:05:41,007 --> 00:05:43,743 to get up to a fire door to get into the room. 106 00:05:43,843 --> 00:05:46,045 Room was filled with junk. 107 00:05:46,145 --> 00:05:48,548 I had $300 left in a checking account. 108 00:05:48,648 --> 00:05:51,117 I couldn't make the next mortgage payment on the house. 109 00:05:51,217 --> 00:05:55,655 I had $10,000 in unpaid bills in a big cardboard box. 110 00:05:56,622 --> 00:05:59,392 - Despite having little to his name, Dan 111 00:05:59,492 --> 00:06:03,596 had what he thought was a solid gold pitch, inspired by one 112 00:06:03,696 --> 00:06:05,465 of his passions in life-- 113 00:06:05,565 --> 00:06:06,766 golf. 114 00:06:06,866 --> 00:06:08,434 Beautiful shot. 115 00:06:08,534 --> 00:06:10,970 - He felt he had this great idea for a golf show. 116 00:06:11,070 --> 00:06:13,973 And so he convinced my mother that he would stop working-- 117 00:06:14,073 --> 00:06:15,842 so now nobody was working-- 118 00:06:15,942 --> 00:06:18,711 and he had a year to try and sell this. 119 00:06:18,811 --> 00:06:21,013 And he kept getting rejected. 120 00:06:21,114 --> 00:06:24,751 He claims he had literally 300 rejections. 121 00:06:24,851 --> 00:06:27,887 It was CBS that called him and said, "OK, Dan, 122 00:06:27,987 --> 00:06:28,988 we're going to do it. 123 00:06:29,088 --> 00:06:31,991 And we'll pay you $50,000." 124 00:06:32,091 --> 00:06:34,427 And my mother is sitting next to him. 125 00:06:34,527 --> 00:06:37,497 And he says, with no money in his pocket, 126 00:06:37,597 --> 00:06:42,602 "I will not do it for anything less than $150,000." 127 00:06:42,702 --> 00:06:45,138 My mother, when she told the story, 128 00:06:45,238 --> 00:06:47,440 she just wanted to kill him. - And I sold it. 129 00:06:47,540 --> 00:06:49,075 I pulled it out. It's a great story. 130 00:06:49,175 --> 00:06:50,543 I pulled it off the last second. 131 00:06:50,643 --> 00:06:52,178 It was called "The CBS Golf Classic." 132 00:06:52,278 --> 00:06:53,679 It stayed on the air for 10 years 133 00:06:53,780 --> 00:06:55,782 and I suddenly had my own company. 134 00:06:55,882 --> 00:06:59,485 - "CBS Television Sports presents 'The CBS Match Play 135 00:06:59,585 --> 00:07:01,020 Golf Classic.'" 136 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:03,156 - The success of the program stoked Dan's creative spark 137 00:07:03,256 --> 00:07:05,858 into a fire that made him eager to plunge deeper 138 00:07:05,958 --> 00:07:07,827 into the field of television. 139 00:07:09,729 --> 00:07:12,799 - My father, out of all the people I've ever met, 140 00:07:12,899 --> 00:07:16,702 I never saw him not working or trying. 141 00:07:16,803 --> 00:07:19,906 He had a script in front of him, rewriting. 142 00:07:20,006 --> 00:07:23,109 He had books-- he was always reading books, reading scripts. 143 00:07:23,209 --> 00:07:25,912 He always was looking for his next idea. 144 00:07:26,012 --> 00:07:30,550 - Dan refused to play by the rules. 145 00:07:30,650 --> 00:07:39,692 Dan was meeting with a Vice-President of ABC. 146 00:07:39,792 --> 00:07:44,797 And this person was sitting with back to the doorway. 147 00:07:44,897 --> 00:07:47,500 I wasn't part of that meeting, but I had 148 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:49,936 to pass by to get to my office. 149 00:07:53,706 --> 00:07:57,577 The shirt collar-- stiff shirt collar-- 150 00:07:57,677 --> 00:08:02,014 was drooping and dripping with sweat. 151 00:08:03,082 --> 00:08:06,118 - Dan's no-nonsense approach did not always make him popular 152 00:08:06,219 --> 00:08:08,588 with the network executives. 153 00:08:08,688 --> 00:08:10,556 His gruff personality once even got 154 00:08:10,656 --> 00:08:12,925 him banned from the set of his own show. 155 00:08:13,025 --> 00:08:18,197 - Dan and I were in a taxi, and he had still 156 00:08:18,297 --> 00:08:22,768 been working on the "CBS Golf Classic." 157 00:08:22,869 --> 00:08:26,873 And they forbid him to come on the scene. 158 00:08:26,973 --> 00:08:30,676 They said he couldn't come on the set. 159 00:08:30,776 --> 00:08:32,211 He's out. 160 00:08:32,311 --> 00:08:37,283 And I turned around and looked at him and he was crying. 161 00:08:37,383 --> 00:08:39,619 That was a very bad time for him. 162 00:08:39,719 --> 00:08:42,121 He had his wife, he had his two girls. 163 00:08:42,221 --> 00:08:46,592 In the meantime, Dan was always working, always 164 00:08:46,692 --> 00:08:48,561 planning something. 165 00:08:48,661 --> 00:08:54,000 He wanted to do a soap opera. 166 00:08:54,100 --> 00:08:56,969 - That's the way I want to live. 167 00:08:57,069 --> 00:08:59,939 - You're a wonderful person, Joe. 168 00:09:00,039 --> 00:09:02,041 - Thank you, ma'am. 169 00:09:03,342 --> 00:09:05,244 - Soap operas started on radio 170 00:09:05,278 --> 00:09:07,613 and they were extremely popular there. 171 00:09:07,647 --> 00:09:11,684 And they came over to TV as one of several genres 172 00:09:11,784 --> 00:09:13,319 that made the transition successfully. 173 00:09:13,419 --> 00:09:16,289 And it was an easy transition, because they were very talky. 174 00:09:16,389 --> 00:09:18,190 It was relatively cheap to produce. 175 00:09:18,291 --> 00:09:21,894 - Soap operas began as a housewife's medium. 176 00:09:21,994 --> 00:09:24,196 - "Mrs. Cliche is always found in the kitchen 177 00:09:24,297 --> 00:09:25,932 next to a washing machine. 178 00:09:26,032 --> 00:09:30,169 Her uniform: shirtwaist dress, half apron, smile." 179 00:09:30,269 --> 00:09:33,239 - Radio understood, and certainly early television 180 00:09:33,339 --> 00:09:35,041 understood, that it was the working mother 181 00:09:35,141 --> 00:09:38,210 who needed some type of relief from the daily chores. 182 00:09:38,311 --> 00:09:40,012 And they created the soap operas, 183 00:09:40,112 --> 00:09:44,116 obviously soap being one of the main sponsorships of the form. 184 00:09:44,216 --> 00:09:46,319 - "You'll know that it's Holsum your very first bite." 185 00:09:55,828 --> 00:09:57,163 - One night, I had a dream. 186 00:09:57,263 --> 00:09:59,265 It was a girl on a train. 187 00:10:00,366 --> 00:10:05,171 And she was riding along a rocky coastline. 188 00:10:05,271 --> 00:10:08,341 I can remember waves smashing on the rocks. 189 00:10:08,441 --> 00:10:11,143 And in the dream, I knew that somehow she 190 00:10:11,243 --> 00:10:17,717 was being hired as a governess to work in this big house. 191 00:10:17,817 --> 00:10:23,389 The train drops her off at the little one-horse station. 192 00:10:23,489 --> 00:10:25,992 It's nighttime. 193 00:10:26,092 --> 00:10:28,661 And she steps out onto the empty platform 194 00:10:28,761 --> 00:10:33,299 and the train pulls away into the darkness and the mist. 195 00:10:33,399 --> 00:10:35,968 And she's standing there all alone. 196 00:10:36,068 --> 00:10:38,170 And I woke up. 197 00:10:38,270 --> 00:10:40,072 My wife was awake. 198 00:10:40,172 --> 00:10:43,876 And I had been thinking about it as I was shaving. 199 00:10:43,976 --> 00:10:46,245 And I thought that this great idea that I had 200 00:10:46,345 --> 00:10:48,280 during the night was garbage. 201 00:10:48,381 --> 00:10:51,384 It was ridiculous and didn't make any sense at all. 202 00:10:51,484 --> 00:10:55,755 - And he told my mother, who was very influential whether things 203 00:10:55,855 --> 00:10:57,390 were a good idea or not, and she's like, 204 00:10:57,490 --> 00:11:00,826 "Danny, Danny, I love it!" 205 00:11:01,927 --> 00:11:04,864 - The big question was where to shop the concept. 206 00:11:04,964 --> 00:11:06,866 There were only three major American television 207 00:11:06,966 --> 00:11:08,134 networks at the time, 208 00:11:08,167 --> 00:11:11,437 and ABC was regularly in last place. 209 00:11:12,405 --> 00:11:15,207 - They didn't have the stable that CBS and NBC had. 210 00:11:15,307 --> 00:11:16,876 They needed daytime programming. 211 00:11:16,976 --> 00:11:18,911 ABC was operating in a bit of a handicap 212 00:11:19,011 --> 00:11:20,413 economically in those days. 213 00:11:20,513 --> 00:11:22,715 - The network was trying to build a serial soap opera 214 00:11:22,815 --> 00:11:25,451 block in the afternoon, and this was the last half hour 215 00:11:25,551 --> 00:11:28,087 before the network stopped programming 216 00:11:28,187 --> 00:11:31,157 and the local stations took over and it was also a time of day 217 00:11:31,257 --> 00:11:33,392 when youngsters began to influence viewing. 218 00:11:33,492 --> 00:11:36,362 - This youth audience, which is always a prized demographic 219 00:11:36,462 --> 00:11:38,397 for television because young people are 220 00:11:38,497 --> 00:11:40,866 more susceptible to branding images, 221 00:11:40,966 --> 00:11:43,135 they're less set in their ways as consumers, 222 00:11:43,235 --> 00:11:45,004 and they have a lot of power and influence 223 00:11:45,104 --> 00:11:47,273 over where their parents spend their money. 224 00:11:47,373 --> 00:11:51,477 - A journey that would bring me to a strange and dark place, 225 00:11:51,577 --> 00:11:55,247 to the edge of the sea, high atop Widow's Hill, 226 00:11:55,347 --> 00:11:58,184 a house called Collinwood. 227 00:11:58,284 --> 00:12:01,921 - I did not envision this brilliant idea of mine, 228 00:12:02,021 --> 00:12:04,990 this dream that I had, as being a daytime show. 229 00:12:05,091 --> 00:12:08,127 Daytime shows were people sitting in kitchens. 230 00:12:08,227 --> 00:12:09,328 - I was asleep. 231 00:12:09,428 --> 00:12:10,863 It was very early in the morning, 232 00:12:10,963 --> 00:12:14,100 and my phone rang in my apartment in New York. 233 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:16,535 And a man named Dan Curtis called me. 234 00:12:16,635 --> 00:12:19,105 And he said, "I have to see you." 235 00:12:19,205 --> 00:12:21,040 - And I told him about this idea and how 236 00:12:21,140 --> 00:12:23,375 I thought what a great nighttime show it would make. 237 00:12:23,476 --> 00:12:25,177 "What a great idea! 238 00:12:25,277 --> 00:12:26,412 Let's do it in the daytime." 239 00:12:26,512 --> 00:12:28,114 I said, "Oh, it's not a daytime show. 240 00:12:28,214 --> 00:12:29,882 This thing isn't a soap." 241 00:12:29,982 --> 00:12:33,119 - And Dan was a very powerful salesman, 242 00:12:33,219 --> 00:12:35,187 but he also sparked something in me. 243 00:12:35,287 --> 00:12:37,289 - By the end of the meeting, we shook hands 244 00:12:37,389 --> 00:12:42,261 and I don't know why I had said to him, 245 00:12:42,361 --> 00:12:45,564 "OK, all right, we'll do this as a daytime show." 246 00:12:47,133 --> 00:12:49,201 Writer Art Wallace was brought on board 247 00:12:49,301 --> 00:12:51,303 to come up with the story. 248 00:12:51,403 --> 00:12:54,874 He titled the treatment, "Shadows on the Wall," 249 00:12:54,974 --> 00:12:56,909 which was inspired in part by a script he had written 250 00:12:57,009 --> 00:13:00,479 called "The House" for the 1950s mystery anthology 251 00:13:00,579 --> 00:13:02,915 series "The Web." 252 00:13:03,015 --> 00:13:07,186 - "'The Web' comes to you live from New York. 253 00:13:07,286 --> 00:13:10,956 Tonight, a story called 'The House,' the story of this house 254 00:13:11,056 --> 00:13:13,459 in New England; the two women who lived in it; 255 00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:17,096 and the stranger who brought back their past." 256 00:13:17,196 --> 00:13:20,032 - Living here with my thoughts in this horrible house. 257 00:13:20,132 --> 00:13:21,901 - But you love the house. 258 00:13:22,001 --> 00:13:24,136 - And now that Pa's home-- 259 00:13:24,236 --> 00:13:26,872 - He's not your father. 260 00:13:26,972 --> 00:13:29,408 Your father's dead. 261 00:13:29,508 --> 00:13:31,110 I killed him. 262 00:13:31,210 --> 00:13:33,279 - We didn't know what we were going to call the show. 263 00:13:33,379 --> 00:13:36,448 Somebody came up with "Shadows on the Wall" 264 00:13:36,549 --> 00:13:37,917 and I didn't like that title. 265 00:13:38,017 --> 00:13:39,451 And I was just-- 266 00:13:39,552 --> 00:13:41,153 "Oh, I've got to come up with a title that makes sense, 267 00:13:41,253 --> 00:13:43,355 something like 'Dark Shadows' would be good." 268 00:13:43,455 --> 00:13:45,925 And somebody said, "Well, shadows are always dark." 269 00:13:46,025 --> 00:13:47,326 I said, "Not necessarily. 270 00:13:47,426 --> 00:13:49,395 There are light shadows as well. 271 00:13:49,495 --> 00:13:51,263 'Dark Shadows'-- that kind of says it all." 272 00:13:55,701 --> 00:13:57,303 - I went up to meet Dan. 273 00:13:57,403 --> 00:14:01,273 There he was, really looking like Dan, about 90 teeth. 274 00:14:01,373 --> 00:14:04,109 He had 900 teeth in here, like that. 275 00:14:04,210 --> 00:14:07,313 And when he was happy, he would gleam his teeth at you, 276 00:14:07,413 --> 00:14:08,480 like this. 277 00:14:08,581 --> 00:14:12,017 We spoke for about 15 minutes. 278 00:14:12,117 --> 00:14:13,152 And he said, "OK, you're it. 279 00:14:13,252 --> 00:14:14,987 I want you to do this." 280 00:14:15,087 --> 00:14:19,158 Well, I learned subsequently that Dan was a person who 281 00:14:19,258 --> 00:14:21,327 wanted instant gratification. 282 00:14:21,427 --> 00:14:23,529 He was very impatient right away. 283 00:14:23,629 --> 00:14:28,067 He says to me, "How soon can I hear the theme?" 284 00:14:29,168 --> 00:14:30,936 Well, fortunately, about a week later, 285 00:14:31,036 --> 00:14:34,240 I was shaving one morning, right in the middle, I heard, 286 00:14:34,340 --> 00:14:36,041 [singing theme]. 287 00:14:48,087 --> 00:14:50,656 I thought, that's it. So I got down there. 288 00:14:50,756 --> 00:14:53,259 And he said, "OK, how are we going to hear this? 289 00:14:53,359 --> 00:14:54,560 Have we got a piano?" 290 00:14:54,660 --> 00:14:56,629 I said, "I'm just going to whistle it to you." 291 00:14:56,729 --> 00:14:59,098 And I went [whistle]. 292 00:14:59,198 --> 00:15:01,400 And he looked at me and his teeth are just like this-- 293 00:15:01,500 --> 00:15:02,601 and he said, I-- 294 00:15:02,701 --> 00:15:03,602 I can't say that word. 295 00:15:03,702 --> 00:15:06,405 He said, "I really love it!" 296 00:15:06,505 --> 00:15:10,209 He said, "OK, when can I hear it with the orchestra?" 297 00:15:10,309 --> 00:15:13,946 - "It is to this isolated old mansion high on Widow's Hill 298 00:15:14,046 --> 00:15:17,416 that 20-year-old Victoria Winters has come to probe 299 00:15:17,516 --> 00:15:20,019 the mystery of her past." 300 00:15:20,119 --> 00:15:23,188 - "Dark Shadows" first crept into American homes 301 00:15:23,289 --> 00:15:28,360 on June 27, 1966. 302 00:15:28,460 --> 00:15:30,396 - I had worked in soap operas before 303 00:15:30,496 --> 00:15:32,331 as the commercial coordinator. 304 00:15:32,431 --> 00:15:37,102 So I knew sort of what I was getting into I thought. 305 00:15:37,202 --> 00:15:39,738 Little did I know what this show would actually become. 306 00:15:39,838 --> 00:15:41,440 - It was a Gothic romance, and it 307 00:15:41,540 --> 00:15:44,576 was about this eccentric family, the Collins family, 308 00:15:44,677 --> 00:15:48,080 in Collinwood, very wealthy, sister and brother living 309 00:15:48,180 --> 00:15:49,415 together. 310 00:15:49,515 --> 00:15:51,483 And of course, that was legendary film star 311 00:15:51,583 --> 00:15:53,152 Joan Bennett and then Louie Edmonds. 312 00:15:53,252 --> 00:15:55,354 And the story was really "Jane Eyre." 313 00:16:00,292 --> 00:16:01,393 - I'm Victoria Winters. 314 00:16:01,493 --> 00:16:02,394 Is Mrs.-- 315 00:16:02,494 --> 00:16:03,395 - Come in, Ms. Winters. 316 00:16:11,737 --> 00:16:17,009 - If you look back into TV Guide when "Dark Shadows" launched 317 00:16:17,109 --> 00:16:20,446 in late June of 1966, not much was 318 00:16:20,546 --> 00:16:22,381 mentioned of the Gothic appeal. 319 00:16:22,481 --> 00:16:25,284 It was just the governess taking care of a 10-year-old. 320 00:16:25,384 --> 00:16:28,454 You would have no idea of what was to come. 321 00:16:28,554 --> 00:16:30,155 - A chauffeur tells a desk clerk, 322 00:16:30,255 --> 00:16:34,059 who tells a housekeeper, who tells me that you're 323 00:16:34,159 --> 00:16:36,395 going to work up in Collinwood. 324 00:16:36,495 --> 00:16:38,564 That makes you a jerk. 325 00:16:38,664 --> 00:16:40,065 - But why? 326 00:16:40,165 --> 00:16:41,467 - At that time, the soap opera was hardly 327 00:16:41,567 --> 00:16:44,336 a format synonymous with groundbreaking television. 328 00:16:44,436 --> 00:16:45,804 - There's one born every minute. 329 00:16:45,904 --> 00:16:48,607 - It was not considered a high art. 330 00:16:48,707 --> 00:16:50,743 And I think that from an acting perspective, 331 00:16:50,843 --> 00:16:52,544 it's basically considered something 332 00:16:52,644 --> 00:16:55,714 that you start with in order to learn the business on the job. 333 00:16:55,814 --> 00:16:57,383 - "Oh, you want to do a soap opera?" 334 00:16:57,483 --> 00:17:01,420 And I said, "No." 335 00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:04,556 I mean, I really didn't want to do a soap opera. 336 00:17:04,656 --> 00:17:08,193 I was on to a different kind of career that I was seeking. 337 00:17:08,293 --> 00:17:11,463 I know what it's like to be locked up. 338 00:17:11,563 --> 00:17:14,566 It's dark and bare and lonely. 339 00:17:14,666 --> 00:17:16,602 Remember, I'm right outside if you need anything. 340 00:17:16,702 --> 00:17:18,837 - Soap operas in those days, it was just 341 00:17:18,937 --> 00:17:22,274 people sitting at coffee tables knocking knees and talking 342 00:17:22,374 --> 00:17:24,510 about who was getting a divorce and that sort of thing. 343 00:17:24,610 --> 00:17:26,378 It was just very mundane. 344 00:17:26,478 --> 00:17:31,617 - I felt at that time that I had missed the boat. 345 00:17:31,717 --> 00:17:36,155 I was 28, 29 years old. 346 00:17:36,255 --> 00:17:37,589 And I said, it's all over. 347 00:17:37,689 --> 00:17:39,124 I'm not going to make it. 348 00:17:39,224 --> 00:17:41,760 I get this call to replace somebody 349 00:17:41,860 --> 00:17:44,263 on this television show. 350 00:17:44,363 --> 00:17:46,498 And I mistakenly took the job. 351 00:17:46,598 --> 00:17:47,733 Atta boy. 352 00:17:47,833 --> 00:17:52,137 Now you're talking like a real ex con. 353 00:17:52,237 --> 00:17:55,574 - It is regrettable that some people have this, oh, you just 354 00:17:55,674 --> 00:17:57,109 worked on soap operas. 355 00:17:57,209 --> 00:18:00,612 I said, if you really knew how hard we work-- 356 00:18:00,712 --> 00:18:04,516 I mean, we were basically doing an entire production in a day 357 00:18:04,616 --> 00:18:06,785 and turning around and doing it the next day. 358 00:18:06,885 --> 00:18:08,554 - I mean, soap operas... 359 00:18:08,654 --> 00:18:10,889 You worked your butt off and you didn't make any money. 360 00:18:14,793 --> 00:18:16,428 - You need ice water in your veins 361 00:18:16,528 --> 00:18:19,131 to do a soap opera because you have so little rehearsal. 362 00:18:19,231 --> 00:18:22,634 - There were usually only five characters on each episode. 363 00:18:22,734 --> 00:18:27,206 And so we had a lot to do on the days that you were on. 364 00:18:27,306 --> 00:18:31,810 - We started at 8 o'clock in the morning with a walk-through 365 00:18:31,910 --> 00:18:33,579 with script in hand. 366 00:18:33,679 --> 00:18:36,715 - We had a camera blocking around 10:00, 367 00:18:36,815 --> 00:18:38,450 and that was after doing the blocking up 368 00:18:38,550 --> 00:18:39,852 in the rehearsal room. 369 00:18:39,952 --> 00:18:41,820 And then we had what we called a stumble-through. 370 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:45,858 - Run it two or three times, and go into makeup and hair. 371 00:18:45,958 --> 00:18:48,560 Get in our fabulous costumes. 372 00:18:48,660 --> 00:18:50,629 - I don't think we actually had a break for lunch. 373 00:18:50,729 --> 00:18:54,766 I don't think the actors ever got outside that little studio. 374 00:18:54,867 --> 00:18:56,802 - And then we had a dress rehearsal. 375 00:18:56,902 --> 00:19:01,440 You'd get notes or lines would be cut or all kinds of things 376 00:19:01,540 --> 00:19:03,609 would happen after a dress rehearsal. 377 00:19:03,709 --> 00:19:05,644 And you were going on to do the show live. 378 00:19:05,744 --> 00:19:07,179 And then we just taped it. 379 00:19:07,279 --> 00:19:10,315 - It was all one half hour shot. 380 00:19:10,415 --> 00:19:11,917 And we had to finish on time because they 381 00:19:12,017 --> 00:19:13,585 started the 4 o'clock news. 382 00:19:13,685 --> 00:19:17,689 - That adds an element of suspense and-- 383 00:19:17,789 --> 00:19:22,294 what?-- fear to the day. 384 00:19:22,995 --> 00:19:25,464 - What is that sound? 385 00:19:25,998 --> 00:19:27,900 - The wind. 386 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:29,868 Or the widows. 387 00:19:29,968 --> 00:19:33,305 - Some actors navigated the rough waters of live on tape 388 00:19:33,405 --> 00:19:34,973 dramatic television better than others. 389 00:19:35,073 --> 00:19:36,675 - ... Moaning with grief 390 00:19:36,775 --> 00:19:38,277 as they have for hundreds of years. 391 00:19:38,377 --> 00:19:44,316 - I've seen men forget their line on a live show 392 00:19:44,416 --> 00:19:47,452 and they'd be as dry as you are now. 393 00:19:47,553 --> 00:19:50,322 And one second later, the sweat would 394 00:19:50,422 --> 00:19:52,658 be pouring off their face. 395 00:19:52,758 --> 00:19:55,394 They had forgotten their line completely. 396 00:19:55,494 --> 00:19:57,763 And somewhere along the way, somebody threw it to them 397 00:19:57,863 --> 00:19:59,965 and they kept on going. 398 00:20:00,065 --> 00:20:02,734 But live TV was fun. 399 00:20:02,834 --> 00:20:04,469 - Look at me when I'm talking to you. 400 00:20:04,570 --> 00:20:05,504 - I can hear you. 401 00:20:05,604 --> 00:20:07,272 - I said, look at me. 402 00:20:07,372 --> 00:20:11,743 - Some of the veteran actors had more difficulty, especially 403 00:20:11,843 --> 00:20:13,478 somebody like Joan Bennett, who had 404 00:20:13,579 --> 00:20:16,915 come from film where they do take after take and a studio 405 00:20:17,015 --> 00:20:18,650 system. 406 00:20:18,750 --> 00:20:23,355 - She was wonderful on this show, but she was terrified. 407 00:20:23,455 --> 00:20:25,557 She had beautiful green eyes that kind of-- 408 00:20:25,657 --> 00:20:29,595 I could see just panic, just absolute panic. 409 00:20:29,695 --> 00:20:33,465 - You've never had a stranger living here, Carolyn. 410 00:20:33,565 --> 00:20:35,267 Perhaps it was a mistake. 411 00:20:35,367 --> 00:20:37,703 - We would meet at the bar at the end of the day 412 00:20:37,803 --> 00:20:40,339 and get soused and take off. 413 00:20:40,439 --> 00:20:44,610 And there wasn't a lot of socializing out of the thing, 414 00:20:44,710 --> 00:20:47,512 but while we were performing, while we were working, 415 00:20:47,613 --> 00:20:49,615 it was really cool. 416 00:20:49,715 --> 00:20:51,483 We really liked each other. 417 00:20:51,583 --> 00:20:54,920 - We were like a family, like a little repertory company. 418 00:20:55,020 --> 00:20:57,322 And we never felt, I don't think, 419 00:20:57,422 --> 00:20:58,724 that we were doing a soap opera. 420 00:20:58,824 --> 00:21:00,659 I never thought of it as that. 421 00:21:00,759 --> 00:21:03,028 I always thought of it as sort of a wonderful anthology 422 00:21:03,128 --> 00:21:04,663 series. 423 00:21:04,763 --> 00:21:07,032 - I know people now say, wow, we were doing something 424 00:21:07,132 --> 00:21:09,701 really groundbreaking. 425 00:21:09,801 --> 00:21:11,770 I never really thought that. 426 00:21:11,870 --> 00:21:17,542 I was so happy to have a job that I just kind of learned 427 00:21:17,643 --> 00:21:21,546 my words and went every day as prepared as I could be. 428 00:21:23,015 --> 00:21:25,584 - Despite the dedication of its cast and crew, 429 00:21:25,684 --> 00:21:30,389 "Dark Shadows" initially struggled to find an audience. 430 00:21:30,489 --> 00:21:33,825 - When the show went on the air, nobody was watching. 431 00:21:33,925 --> 00:21:37,796 And as we got past the first 13 weeks, 432 00:21:37,896 --> 00:21:39,364 I knew we were going to be history, 433 00:21:39,464 --> 00:21:40,499 we weren't going to make it. 434 00:21:43,135 --> 00:21:45,337 - Nobody paid any attention to it. 435 00:21:45,437 --> 00:21:46,972 It got bad ratings-- 436 00:21:47,072 --> 00:21:48,640 well, hardly any. 437 00:21:48,740 --> 00:21:51,643 - The way in which you achieved ratings on these shows 438 00:21:51,743 --> 00:21:54,846 was to see to it that the audience that you had, 439 00:21:54,946 --> 00:21:58,917 instead of watching 1 1/2 times a week, or twice a week, 440 00:21:59,017 --> 00:22:01,053 watched 2 1/2 times a week. 441 00:22:01,153 --> 00:22:03,388 That tied very much into the way in which 442 00:22:03,488 --> 00:22:05,557 you had to plot these shows. 443 00:22:05,657 --> 00:22:07,392 - Sorry, I was just getting a cup of coffee. 444 00:22:07,492 --> 00:22:08,427 - My name's Devlin. 445 00:22:08,527 --> 00:22:09,494 - What? 446 00:22:09,594 --> 00:22:10,729 Why, Burke, it's nice to see you. 447 00:22:10,829 --> 00:22:13,031 - Burke Devlin. I wired for three rooms. 448 00:22:13,131 --> 00:22:15,434 - We weren't moving the plot fast enough. 449 00:22:15,534 --> 00:22:16,768 It had to move faster. 450 00:22:16,868 --> 00:22:21,740 He was always trying to energize the process 451 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:23,709 of the unfolding of the show. 452 00:22:23,809 --> 00:22:25,777 His instincts weren't always wrong, 453 00:22:25,877 --> 00:22:29,414 but with regard to how a soap opera works, 454 00:22:29,514 --> 00:22:30,982 it wasn't the best. 455 00:22:31,083 --> 00:22:32,751 - Roger, who else knows about this? 456 00:22:32,851 --> 00:22:33,985 - What difference does it make? 457 00:22:34,086 --> 00:22:35,487 - I want to know. 458 00:22:35,587 --> 00:22:37,389 - The show wasn't doing well. 459 00:22:37,489 --> 00:22:39,858 And it was really kind of dying. 460 00:22:39,958 --> 00:22:41,526 - He said to me, "Tell me the truth. 461 00:22:41,626 --> 00:22:43,495 You're going to have to cancel me, aren't you?" 462 00:22:43,595 --> 00:22:45,697 I said, "Yeah, their numbers are not really good." 463 00:22:45,797 --> 00:22:47,799 - And he called the guy at ABC, he said, 464 00:22:47,899 --> 00:22:50,902 "Look, give me just 13 more weeks. 465 00:22:51,002 --> 00:22:52,404 That's all I'm asking. 466 00:22:52,504 --> 00:22:54,606 Let me just see if I can salvage this thing." 467 00:22:54,706 --> 00:22:58,510 He said, "Then let me take the lid off." 468 00:22:58,610 --> 00:23:01,913 I said, "What do you mean by that, Dan?" 469 00:23:02,013 --> 00:23:04,549 He said, "Let me really push the envelope." 470 00:23:04,649 --> 00:23:08,820 And he came in one morning and he said one of his daughters-- 471 00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:10,722 I don't remember which one-- 472 00:23:10,822 --> 00:23:13,825 said to him-- he was complaining. 473 00:23:13,925 --> 00:23:15,794 It wasn't working out for him. 474 00:23:15,894 --> 00:23:19,064 - Me and my sister, we were the perfect age for "Dark Shadows," 475 00:23:19,164 --> 00:23:21,032 and we were very into it. 476 00:23:21,133 --> 00:23:23,068 And one day, he was asking us about it. 477 00:23:23,168 --> 00:23:26,438 And the way he always told the story, he always mimicked us. 478 00:23:26,538 --> 00:23:29,908 He said, my daughters said, daddy, make it scarier. 479 00:23:30,008 --> 00:23:32,644 - And he came in that next morning 480 00:23:32,744 --> 00:23:35,647 and he said, we're going to do ghosts and ghouls. 481 00:23:35,747 --> 00:23:37,582 - Did you see the ghost? 482 00:23:37,682 --> 00:23:40,619 - David, I've told you there are no such things as ghosts 483 00:23:40,719 --> 00:23:42,687 - Yes, there are. I've seen them. 484 00:23:42,721 --> 00:23:43,622 - Where? 485 00:23:43,722 --> 00:23:45,223 - Here at Collinwood. 486 00:23:45,323 --> 00:23:47,492 They like it best at night. 487 00:23:47,592 --> 00:23:48,894 - I figured, why the hell not? 488 00:23:48,994 --> 00:23:51,530 Let's make it really scary. 489 00:23:51,630 --> 00:23:52,531 What have I got to lose? 490 00:23:52,631 --> 00:23:53,765 I'm going off the air. 491 00:23:53,865 --> 00:23:54,866 No one's ever done anything like this. 492 00:23:54,966 --> 00:23:55,867 I'll let it rip. 493 00:24:00,105 --> 00:24:03,708 - And I had said to Dan, "Once you go supernatural, 494 00:24:03,809 --> 00:24:04,943 you can't go back. 495 00:24:05,043 --> 00:24:05,944 This is it." 496 00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,082 - I was on the show the very first day when our director, 497 00:24:11,183 --> 00:24:14,152 Lela Swift, read the script and said, "Oh... 498 00:24:14,252 --> 00:24:15,153 Oh! 499 00:24:15,253 --> 00:24:16,254 We're doing a ghost story." 500 00:24:20,792 --> 00:24:23,562 - Again, when you are in a little bit of a survival mode, 501 00:24:23,662 --> 00:24:25,664 you were more willing to take chances. 502 00:24:25,764 --> 00:24:28,133 ABC was an innovative network, largely because it 503 00:24:28,233 --> 00:24:31,937 was typically a last place network, and the history of TV 504 00:24:32,037 --> 00:24:33,505 is always the last place network is 505 00:24:33,605 --> 00:24:35,040 going to be the most innovative network. 506 00:24:35,140 --> 00:24:36,842 But you know there was a real emphasis 507 00:24:36,942 --> 00:24:39,911 on going for a real vision there, that they needed 508 00:24:40,011 --> 00:24:41,680 to do something different. 509 00:24:41,780 --> 00:24:44,783 - Dan Curtis said to me, "So what do you think you can do?" 510 00:24:44,883 --> 00:24:47,085 There was the character of Laura, 511 00:24:47,185 --> 00:24:51,189 who was in an institution in Phoenix, Arizona. 512 00:24:51,289 --> 00:24:53,825 And she was getting out of the institution, 513 00:24:53,925 --> 00:24:56,027 and she wanted to come to Collinwood. 514 00:24:56,127 --> 00:25:03,168 - I had a feeling about you, a feeling that it's not good 515 00:25:03,268 --> 00:25:08,607 for you to be in this house, that you might be happier 516 00:25:08,707 --> 00:25:10,976 and safer away from Collinwood. 517 00:25:11,076 --> 00:25:15,180 - I said, "She is a Phoenix, a mythological creature who 518 00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:20,018 every 100 years goes into the fire and is reborn. 519 00:25:20,118 --> 00:25:24,823 And that's what she wants to do with her son, take him back, 520 00:25:24,923 --> 00:25:26,758 they'll go into the fire together, 521 00:25:26,858 --> 00:25:30,028 and they'll be reborn together for another 100 years." 522 00:25:30,128 --> 00:25:32,330 - He's going to be reborn, just as I've been 523 00:25:32,430 --> 00:25:36,234 reborn century after century. 524 00:25:36,334 --> 00:25:41,039 - Dan and his vice president are looking at me and I'm saying, 525 00:25:41,139 --> 00:25:43,808 "Oh, my god, I blew it." 526 00:25:43,909 --> 00:25:47,045 And Dan said, "Well, you think you can do it?" 527 00:25:47,145 --> 00:25:50,582 I said, "Look, you're only on the air for four more weeks. 528 00:25:50,682 --> 00:25:52,584 What have you got to lose?" 529 00:25:52,684 --> 00:25:55,086 - The Phoenix is reborn! 530 00:25:58,390 --> 00:26:03,361 - As soon as it hit the air, the ratings started going up 531 00:26:03,461 --> 00:26:06,164 and a couple of sponsors started buying in. 532 00:26:06,264 --> 00:26:08,934 Four weeks was all it was supposed to last. 533 00:26:09,034 --> 00:26:11,803 With all the increases, ABC decided 534 00:26:11,903 --> 00:26:14,806 to renew for another 13 weeks. 535 00:26:14,906 --> 00:26:18,143 Dan Curtis and I were talking. 536 00:26:18,243 --> 00:26:19,978 And he said, "What do we do now?" 537 00:26:20,078 --> 00:26:24,349 "Let's do something continually in the supernatural." 538 00:26:24,449 --> 00:26:28,920 So he said, "How about a vampire?" 539 00:26:29,020 --> 00:26:30,221 I said, "That's it!" 540 00:26:37,996 --> 00:26:40,265 - I am Dracula. 541 00:26:42,267 --> 00:26:44,102 - Historically, horror literature 542 00:26:44,202 --> 00:26:46,371 and popular entertainment have portrayed the vampire 543 00:26:46,471 --> 00:26:50,809 as a cold, bloodthirsty monster, typified most famously 544 00:26:50,909 --> 00:26:53,278 by Bram Stoker's "Dracula." 545 00:26:53,378 --> 00:26:55,847 Numerous movies had exploited such a character 546 00:26:55,947 --> 00:26:59,084 to chilling effect, but "Dark Shadows" 547 00:26:59,184 --> 00:27:02,253 was about to shatter the mold with its daring approach 548 00:27:02,354 --> 00:27:04,155 to the undead menace. 549 00:27:08,927 --> 00:27:10,428 - Yes? 550 00:27:10,528 --> 00:27:15,000 - Let's pretend we are the first people doing a vampire series 551 00:27:15,100 --> 00:27:16,034 anything. 552 00:27:16,134 --> 00:27:17,802 We make our own ground rules. 553 00:27:17,902 --> 00:27:21,106 They never heard of Bela Lugosi, the people in this town. 554 00:27:21,206 --> 00:27:23,108 They never saw "Dracula." 555 00:27:23,208 --> 00:27:24,142 They never read it. 556 00:27:24,242 --> 00:27:25,777 They knew nothing about it. 557 00:27:25,877 --> 00:27:27,879 He can't turn into a wolf. 558 00:27:27,979 --> 00:27:34,052 He is a relatively human-seeming body who thrives on blood. 559 00:27:34,152 --> 00:27:36,855 - We were going to make him a reluctant vampire. 560 00:27:36,955 --> 00:27:40,058 And all of a sudden, the emotional possibilities 561 00:27:40,158 --> 00:27:43,328 of playing on that, that he really 562 00:27:43,428 --> 00:27:47,098 did not want to do this to people, 563 00:27:47,198 --> 00:27:48,433 he didn't want to be who he was. 564 00:27:55,106 --> 00:27:58,376 - Don't cast a guy who looks like Bela Lugosi. 565 00:27:58,476 --> 00:27:59,811 Get some guy who-- 566 00:27:59,911 --> 00:28:03,381 young, blonde guy, not an old vampire. 567 00:28:03,481 --> 00:28:07,952 But get a young blonde guy, and we'll play it from there. 568 00:28:13,058 --> 00:28:16,094 - Canadian stage actor Jonathan Frid 569 00:28:16,194 --> 00:28:19,764 was cast as the vampire Barnabas Collins. 570 00:28:19,864 --> 00:28:24,169 He arrived at Collinwood in the spring of 1967. 571 00:28:24,269 --> 00:28:26,171 - Oh, Madam. 572 00:28:26,271 --> 00:28:31,242 If you would, you may tell her that it's Barnabas Collins. 573 00:28:31,342 --> 00:28:35,847 - Jonathan Frid was on his away to California 574 00:28:35,947 --> 00:28:38,016 and the phone rang. 575 00:28:38,116 --> 00:28:41,152 He was halfway out the door-- true story-- 576 00:28:41,252 --> 00:28:44,956 turned around, picked up the phone, 577 00:28:45,056 --> 00:28:48,293 got the job as Barnabas Collins. 578 00:28:48,393 --> 00:28:51,062 - There's been a drastic change in my life. 579 00:28:51,162 --> 00:28:53,998 I am no longer really human. 580 00:28:54,099 --> 00:28:57,068 - I remember going to the office and seeing all these cadavers 581 00:28:57,168 --> 00:29:01,106 sitting around that were also up at the last for the part. 582 00:29:01,206 --> 00:29:05,043 And when I realized that I had out-cadavered them all, 583 00:29:05,143 --> 00:29:07,212 it wasn't exactly too heartening. 584 00:29:07,312 --> 00:29:09,380 But anyway, the actual person who cast me 585 00:29:09,481 --> 00:29:11,850 was Ron Sproat, who was one of the writers, 586 00:29:11,950 --> 00:29:14,052 and he'd been a playwright at Yale 587 00:29:14,152 --> 00:29:16,087 while I was there as a directing major. 588 00:29:16,187 --> 00:29:19,057 - Ron and I one time, we were in a saloon in the village 589 00:29:19,157 --> 00:29:20,458 and there was Jon. 590 00:29:20,558 --> 00:29:22,427 And Jon said, "Oh, I'm going to be on that show. 591 00:29:22,527 --> 00:29:24,162 I'm going to play the vampire." 592 00:29:24,262 --> 00:29:25,964 And we though, "Oh shit." 593 00:29:26,064 --> 00:29:28,800 - Of course, they hired Jonathan Frid, who when I looked at him 594 00:29:28,900 --> 00:29:29,968 I wanted to faint. 595 00:29:30,068 --> 00:29:32,804 I mean, they had hired Bela Lugosi. 596 00:29:32,904 --> 00:29:35,140 And I knew he was scared stiff. 597 00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:38,910 Suddenly he's the star of a soap opera. 598 00:29:39,010 --> 00:29:42,413 - What is true, father? What? 599 00:29:46,017 --> 00:29:49,187 - So I said, "Jonathan, you're a nice guy. 600 00:29:49,287 --> 00:29:53,591 Be a nice guy with everybody and all the characters. 601 00:29:53,691 --> 00:29:54,959 Make them like you. 602 00:29:55,059 --> 00:29:56,227 They're your family. 603 00:29:56,327 --> 00:29:58,363 So just play it easy. 604 00:29:58,463 --> 00:29:59,364 Relax it. 605 00:29:59,464 --> 00:30:01,232 And don't go overboard." 606 00:30:01,332 --> 00:30:03,368 And that's what he did. 607 00:30:03,468 --> 00:30:05,937 - And of course, he turned out to be perfect. 608 00:30:07,238 --> 00:30:09,340 - I was a very nervous actor. 609 00:30:09,440 --> 00:30:14,045 I think what made the part work for me is that Barnabas also 610 00:30:14,145 --> 00:30:15,547 was a very nervous character. 611 00:30:15,647 --> 00:30:18,216 If you accept the premise, he comes out of his coffin, 612 00:30:18,316 --> 00:30:21,619 having been in it for 150 years or whatever, 613 00:30:21,719 --> 00:30:23,922 and he comes out into this new world 614 00:30:24,022 --> 00:30:26,324 and has to tell a lie instantly, that he 615 00:30:26,424 --> 00:30:30,995 was the great grandson of this portrait, when in fact he's 616 00:30:31,095 --> 00:30:32,564 the same guy. 617 00:30:32,664 --> 00:30:34,632 - Forgive me for staring, but for the moment it 618 00:30:34,732 --> 00:30:36,000 seems as though I've seen a-- 619 00:30:36,100 --> 00:30:37,535 - Ghost? 620 00:30:37,635 --> 00:30:41,172 - Well, the likeness is remarkable! 621 00:30:41,272 --> 00:30:43,141 - So he was a very nervous person, 622 00:30:43,241 --> 00:30:46,878 and as he adjusted and got his act together, so I as an actor 623 00:30:46,978 --> 00:30:48,479 got adjusted to television. 624 00:30:48,580 --> 00:30:51,015 So the two of us kind of went along together. 625 00:30:51,115 --> 00:30:53,518 And that's probably why people maybe 626 00:30:53,618 --> 00:30:55,253 identified me as the vampire. 627 00:30:58,456 --> 00:31:01,559 - He chose to play him not like a monster, 628 00:31:01,659 --> 00:31:05,029 but like a romantic hero who has been cursed, 629 00:31:05,129 --> 00:31:10,535 who has been given this death sentence to have to be someone 630 00:31:10,635 --> 00:31:13,504 who drinks blood to stay alive. 631 00:31:13,605 --> 00:31:16,241 - I am free now and alive. 632 00:31:16,341 --> 00:31:20,144 The chains with which she bound me are broken, 633 00:31:20,245 --> 00:31:24,048 and I've returned to live the life I never had... 634 00:31:30,555 --> 00:31:33,625 Whatever that may turn out to be. 635 00:31:33,725 --> 00:31:36,527 - Everything about him, unlike any vampire that's ever 636 00:31:36,628 --> 00:31:39,364 been written, was so human. 637 00:31:39,464 --> 00:31:41,566 And people could attach themselves to it. 638 00:31:41,666 --> 00:31:46,237 They could say, oh, I know that feeling. 639 00:31:46,337 --> 00:31:47,572 I've had that feeling. 640 00:31:47,672 --> 00:31:53,411 - The depth of his guilt and the anguish 641 00:31:53,511 --> 00:31:58,149 that he experienced as a result of what he was cursed to be 642 00:31:58,249 --> 00:32:00,218 and what he had become-- 643 00:32:00,318 --> 00:32:03,221 that's what he chose to play, rather than the fiend who 644 00:32:03,321 --> 00:32:05,990 climbs through the window and has the teeth hanging out 645 00:32:06,090 --> 00:32:07,659 and the long fingernails. 646 00:32:07,759 --> 00:32:09,193 - I feel your presence. 647 00:32:09,294 --> 00:32:11,095 Show yourself! 648 00:32:13,631 --> 00:32:15,566 - He was a tragic hero. 649 00:32:15,667 --> 00:32:18,036 He'd messed around with the wrong woman 650 00:32:18,136 --> 00:32:20,371 and she fixed him forever. 651 00:32:20,471 --> 00:32:23,374 - I set a curse on you, Barnabas Collins. 652 00:32:23,474 --> 00:32:25,276 - She kept saying, I'll take away the curse 653 00:32:25,376 --> 00:32:26,277 if you'll love me. 654 00:32:26,377 --> 00:32:27,312 But he wouldn't do it. 655 00:32:27,412 --> 00:32:30,081 - I could not love you. 656 00:32:30,181 --> 00:32:32,317 - Perhaps this time you will learn to love me. 657 00:32:32,417 --> 00:32:33,685 - Think about that. 658 00:32:33,785 --> 00:32:36,054 I mean, here's this enduring, iconic archetype 659 00:32:36,154 --> 00:32:39,424 of international horror who's represented 660 00:32:39,524 --> 00:32:40,758 one way for all these years. 661 00:32:40,858 --> 00:32:42,527 And then Dan Curtis and Jonathan Frid 662 00:32:42,627 --> 00:32:44,262 basically came along and changed that. 663 00:32:44,362 --> 00:32:47,165 That was hugely significant from a cultural perspective. 664 00:32:52,236 --> 00:32:55,006 - Oh, it was completely new. 665 00:32:55,106 --> 00:32:57,709 There had never been anything like this on television. 666 00:32:57,809 --> 00:32:59,610 - I think it was the excitement about that. 667 00:32:59,711 --> 00:33:02,547 And certainly for teenagers, it was like a new discovery, 668 00:33:02,647 --> 00:33:08,486 an entry into adult sexuality, but a very odd adult sexuality. 669 00:33:11,522 --> 00:33:14,192 - It really was about compulsive sex. 670 00:33:14,292 --> 00:33:16,127 "I've got to have it or I'll die." 671 00:33:16,227 --> 00:33:18,496 Well, literally for Barnabas, that was true. 672 00:33:18,596 --> 00:33:20,131 "I've got to have it or I'll die." 673 00:33:20,231 --> 00:33:23,568 And especially teenagers, they're 674 00:33:23,668 --> 00:33:25,136 going to die if they don't have it. 675 00:33:25,236 --> 00:33:26,704 - It's a sexual metaphor. 676 00:33:26,804 --> 00:33:31,542 So everybody who got bit always grabbed their partner and-- 677 00:33:31,642 --> 00:33:36,314 like it was very pleasurable. 678 00:33:36,414 --> 00:33:41,252 - Dan was so worried about homoeroticism or anything 679 00:33:41,352 --> 00:33:45,289 like that, so that when Barnabas bites somebody, 680 00:33:45,390 --> 00:33:49,127 women got bit on the neck and man got bit on the wrist. 681 00:33:49,227 --> 00:33:51,062 - Your arm looks strange. 682 00:33:51,162 --> 00:33:54,332 - We had a representative that sat in the green room, 683 00:33:54,432 --> 00:33:57,435 and if she saw any blood at all, she'd go back 684 00:33:57,535 --> 00:33:59,637 and she'd say, "I'm sorry, we can't have any blood," 685 00:33:59,737 --> 00:34:05,176 because, you know, Ivory Snow or Ponds was our sponsor 686 00:34:05,276 --> 00:34:07,812 and she was afraid that people would turn off 687 00:34:07,912 --> 00:34:09,380 because it was so scary. 688 00:34:16,354 --> 00:34:18,723 - And it became apparent very early on 689 00:34:18,823 --> 00:34:22,193 that we were onto something. 690 00:34:25,596 --> 00:34:28,466 - It came on at 4 o'clock in the afternoon, 691 00:34:28,566 --> 00:34:33,704 just in time for the kids to be home from school. 692 00:34:33,805 --> 00:34:38,810 And they got a horror show at 4 o'clock in the afternoon. 693 00:34:38,910 --> 00:34:40,578 Unheard of. 694 00:34:40,678 --> 00:34:46,250 Not some stupid, silly little drama of two people kissing. 695 00:34:46,350 --> 00:34:49,487 This was the real McCoy, bloodsucking and stuff. 696 00:34:53,825 --> 00:34:57,862 - Vampires and Gothic stuff... 697 00:34:57,962 --> 00:35:02,166 I'm 8 or 9 or 10, and it was just right up my alley 698 00:35:02,266 --> 00:35:03,868 because that's the stuff I loved. 699 00:35:03,968 --> 00:35:05,570 - I don't know how we knew that there 700 00:35:05,670 --> 00:35:10,475 was going to be this show about vampires, but we did. 701 00:35:10,575 --> 00:35:14,245 And I remember it came on late in the afternoon 702 00:35:14,345 --> 00:35:18,683 so that if we jumped off the bus, school bus home, 703 00:35:18,783 --> 00:35:22,220 and ran inside one of our houses, 704 00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:24,155 we'd get there right when it started. 705 00:35:24,255 --> 00:35:27,458 - I was a very, very young teenager at that point. 706 00:35:27,558 --> 00:35:29,760 I would never run home from school to watch a soap opera. 707 00:35:29,861 --> 00:35:31,362 Never. 708 00:35:31,462 --> 00:35:32,830 Would never have occurred to me or my friends-- 709 00:35:32,930 --> 00:35:35,199 I mean, particularly male friends. 710 00:35:35,299 --> 00:35:38,202 And all of a sudden, we had to get home at 4:00 or 4:30, 711 00:35:38,302 --> 00:35:40,471 whenever it was, because we had to see Barnabas 712 00:35:40,571 --> 00:35:41,939 on "Dark Shadows." 713 00:35:42,039 --> 00:35:45,543 - Anybody I meet and say I worked on "Dark Shadows," 714 00:35:45,643 --> 00:35:47,478 they say, "Oh, I used to run home from school. 715 00:35:47,578 --> 00:35:49,747 I'd get home at 4 o'clock to see it." 716 00:35:49,847 --> 00:35:51,449 Everybody. 717 00:35:51,549 --> 00:35:53,384 - There was something about it that just attracted us. 718 00:35:53,484 --> 00:35:54,785 It was exciting. It was out of the ordinary. 719 00:35:54,886 --> 00:35:56,187 It was unusual. 720 00:35:56,287 --> 00:36:00,224 - It wasn't your mom's Gothic romance. 721 00:36:00,324 --> 00:36:01,692 It was your Gothic romance. 722 00:36:01,792 --> 00:36:04,595 These were characters that were talking to you. 723 00:36:04,695 --> 00:36:07,532 - That I should come to this century, 724 00:36:07,632 --> 00:36:10,835 find you so like Josette. 725 00:36:10,935 --> 00:36:12,737 - Initially, Barnabas was only intended 726 00:36:12,837 --> 00:36:15,339 to be on the show for 13 weeks. 727 00:36:15,439 --> 00:36:18,342 Dan had planned to kill him off while young viewers were home 728 00:36:18,442 --> 00:36:19,944 watching on summer vacation. 729 00:36:20,044 --> 00:36:21,512 - He'd been there a couple of weeks 730 00:36:21,612 --> 00:36:23,614 and Dan Curtis is coming down the hallway, 731 00:36:23,714 --> 00:36:26,751 holding what looked like some perhaps legal papers. 732 00:36:26,851 --> 00:36:29,253 And Jonathan thought, I'm getting sacked. 733 00:36:29,353 --> 00:36:30,655 This is the notice. 734 00:36:30,755 --> 00:36:32,523 And Dan said, "Here, these are for you, Jonathan." 735 00:36:32,623 --> 00:36:33,791 And he said, "What?" 736 00:36:33,891 --> 00:36:35,660 He said, "They're fan letters." 737 00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:38,629 And Jonathan said, "Fan letters for me?" 738 00:36:38,729 --> 00:36:42,300 And that was the beginning of weeks and weeks 739 00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:44,635 of thousands of letters started to come in. 740 00:36:44,735 --> 00:36:47,004 And he was stunned that all these people 741 00:36:47,104 --> 00:36:49,840 were watching the show and loving what he was doing. 742 00:36:49,941 --> 00:36:53,411 - I remember going out the front door of the studio, 743 00:36:53,511 --> 00:36:55,279 and there were some school kids there. 744 00:36:55,379 --> 00:36:58,749 We signed a few autographs and chatted and whatnot. 745 00:36:58,849 --> 00:37:01,319 A week later, it was double the size 746 00:37:01,419 --> 00:37:02,853 and then quadruple the size. 747 00:37:02,954 --> 00:37:04,655 And suddenly we had a whole street 748 00:37:04,755 --> 00:37:08,793 full of kids who had come to the studio after school to see us. 749 00:37:15,933 --> 00:37:18,369 - You'd sign enough autographs to get through the crowd 750 00:37:18,469 --> 00:37:20,805 and hopefully make it up to the corner so you could get a cab 751 00:37:20,905 --> 00:37:22,039 and get out of there. 752 00:37:22,139 --> 00:37:23,808 - They were wild. They were wonderful. 753 00:37:23,908 --> 00:37:26,344 I had them stealing and getting in the back of my truck 754 00:37:26,444 --> 00:37:27,945 and I didn't know it and I'd get home 755 00:37:28,045 --> 00:37:29,814 and they found out where I lived. 756 00:37:29,914 --> 00:37:31,949 Oh, man. That was insane. 757 00:37:32,049 --> 00:37:33,651 - People don't usually talk about this. 758 00:37:33,751 --> 00:37:37,488 It was very popular with prostitutes and drug addicts 759 00:37:37,588 --> 00:37:39,457 because they were just waking up-- 760 00:37:39,557 --> 00:37:41,726 4 o'clock, watching our show. 761 00:37:41,826 --> 00:37:43,761 So I'd be walking down 48th Street 762 00:37:43,861 --> 00:37:45,863 and the hookers would be out there, "Jeb! 763 00:37:45,963 --> 00:37:46,864 Hey, Jeb!" 764 00:37:51,802 --> 00:37:57,308 - We had to hire a company to handle all the fan mail. 765 00:37:58,409 --> 00:37:59,744 It was unbelievable. 766 00:37:59,844 --> 00:38:01,646 At the beginning, we would get it and read it 767 00:38:01,746 --> 00:38:03,014 and we'd love reading the fan mail. 768 00:38:03,114 --> 00:38:06,751 Well, the fan mail got to be so gigantic 769 00:38:06,851 --> 00:38:08,052 that you couldn't read it. 770 00:38:08,152 --> 00:38:09,920 I mean, the company had to answer letters. 771 00:38:10,021 --> 00:38:12,456 It was just-- it got to be insane. 772 00:38:12,556 --> 00:38:14,659 - "16 Magazine..." 773 00:38:14,759 --> 00:38:17,561 I was on the cover of "16 Magazine" 774 00:38:17,595 --> 00:38:19,664 and "Tiger Beat" magazine. 775 00:38:19,697 --> 00:38:21,632 - And I also used to get "16 Magazine." 776 00:38:21,732 --> 00:38:26,070 And so "16 Magazine" always had the cast. 777 00:38:26,170 --> 00:38:31,509 And Jonathan Frid's picture was on my wall 778 00:38:31,609 --> 00:38:32,643 because I wanted to get bit. 779 00:38:38,616 --> 00:38:42,553 - The articles that we wrote were generated by the mail 780 00:38:42,653 --> 00:38:44,655 that we got from the readers. 781 00:38:44,755 --> 00:38:49,093 And it was very interesting because all of a sudden 782 00:38:49,193 --> 00:38:52,830 we started getting some random letters 783 00:38:52,930 --> 00:38:56,667 and they were asking about who played Barnabas 784 00:38:56,767 --> 00:38:59,470 Collins on "Dark Shadows." 785 00:38:59,570 --> 00:39:01,706 And when we did take a look at the show, 786 00:39:01,806 --> 00:39:04,742 we saw that he played a vampire, which 787 00:39:04,842 --> 00:39:09,680 is a very romantic figure to a lot of young girls. 788 00:39:09,780 --> 00:39:11,382 But it was very unusual, because we 789 00:39:11,482 --> 00:39:14,151 didn't get mail about soap opera people, 790 00:39:14,185 --> 00:39:16,821 even young people on soap operas. 791 00:39:16,854 --> 00:39:19,390 We also featured a lot of things about the storyline 792 00:39:19,490 --> 00:39:22,493 of the show, which was very unusual because you didn't 793 00:39:22,593 --> 00:39:25,863 usually write about what an episode of "The Brady Bunch" 794 00:39:25,963 --> 00:39:27,565 was about or "The Partridge Family." 795 00:39:27,665 --> 00:39:29,934 You wrote about what David Cassidy 796 00:39:30,034 --> 00:39:31,602 liked to eat for breakfast. 797 00:39:31,702 --> 00:39:33,571 But it was very different with "Dark Shadows." 798 00:39:33,671 --> 00:39:36,006 It was a whole show that had an appeal. 799 00:39:36,107 --> 00:39:40,144 Definitely more dangerous, more edgy 800 00:39:40,244 --> 00:39:44,648 than a lot of the other things that we would write about. 801 00:39:45,750 --> 00:39:48,419 The creator of "Dark Shadows," Dan Curtis, 802 00:39:48,519 --> 00:39:54,892 was quite astute because he understood the power of having 803 00:39:54,992 --> 00:39:56,794 an inroad to this audience. 804 00:39:56,894 --> 00:39:59,597 - "You can never tell what in the dark shadows 805 00:39:59,697 --> 00:40:02,666 or what lurks behind each door. 806 00:40:02,767 --> 00:40:05,436 But with groovy horror heads for friends, 807 00:40:05,536 --> 00:40:07,037 you won't be scared anymore!" 808 00:40:07,138 --> 00:40:09,840 - You may notice some fog drifting 809 00:40:09,940 --> 00:40:11,842 in from backstage here. 810 00:40:11,942 --> 00:40:13,544 You'll understand why when you see 811 00:40:13,644 --> 00:40:16,614 the gentleman who needs no introduction to the younger 812 00:40:16,714 --> 00:40:17,681 generation. 813 00:40:17,782 --> 00:40:18,682 Watch. 814 00:40:22,887 --> 00:40:24,789 - What is your blood type? 815 00:40:24,889 --> 00:40:31,028 - I think it's O. Back to the hearse. 816 00:40:34,665 --> 00:40:38,135 - He did a lot of appearances, sometimes in very small towns 817 00:40:38,235 --> 00:40:39,670 across the country. 818 00:40:39,770 --> 00:40:42,006 And they wouldn't be prepared for the thousands 819 00:40:42,106 --> 00:40:43,541 of fans who would appear. 820 00:40:43,641 --> 00:40:46,677 And in fact, in his neighborhood, 821 00:40:46,777 --> 00:40:50,114 he was being stalked at the grocery store 822 00:40:50,214 --> 00:40:52,049 and he was having to run in and out 823 00:40:52,149 --> 00:40:55,119 and discovered it was going to be too difficult to stay 824 00:40:55,219 --> 00:40:57,955 in his apartment, and he ended up leaving that apartment 825 00:40:58,055 --> 00:41:01,125 and moving into a apartment that had a doorman. 826 00:41:01,926 --> 00:41:03,861 - This show has really caught on. 827 00:41:03,961 --> 00:41:06,931 I know in my house, my son runs home after school. 828 00:41:07,031 --> 00:41:08,566 We can't pull him away from the set. 829 00:41:08,666 --> 00:41:10,134 - And this, of course, is the star of it. 830 00:41:10,234 --> 00:41:12,102 Here's Jonathan Frid. 831 00:41:14,872 --> 00:41:17,208 - I may lose interest in what you're saying. 832 00:41:17,308 --> 00:41:19,043 This lovely neck right here. - I know. 833 00:41:19,143 --> 00:41:20,211 I know. 834 00:41:20,311 --> 00:41:23,080 We hear, in that part of television, 835 00:41:23,180 --> 00:41:25,115 that soap opera is... 836 00:41:25,216 --> 00:41:28,819 I mean, tedious work. It has to be. 837 00:41:28,919 --> 00:41:30,855 You have to learn a new script every day, don't you? 838 00:41:30,955 --> 00:41:32,056 - Yes. 839 00:41:32,156 --> 00:41:33,224 Oh, yes, it's tedious in that sense. 840 00:41:33,324 --> 00:41:35,226 - Sometimes he would be on every day. 841 00:41:35,326 --> 00:41:37,094 He was exhausted come the weekend, 842 00:41:37,194 --> 00:41:38,929 and yet they often had appearances for him 843 00:41:39,029 --> 00:41:40,264 to go on on the weekend. 844 00:41:40,364 --> 00:41:42,299 So it was a very draining schedule for him. 845 00:41:42,399 --> 00:41:44,869 - He actually had dyslexia, which he only 846 00:41:44,969 --> 00:41:47,037 realized around that time. 847 00:41:47,137 --> 00:41:49,540 So the fact that he had to overnight learn lines 848 00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:52,009 was always challenging and would keep him up late at night. 849 00:41:52,109 --> 00:41:55,246 - Tomorrow evening will be an occasion long remembered. 850 00:41:58,949 --> 00:42:02,086 That night must go nothing wrong. 851 00:42:02,186 --> 00:42:04,221 - Sweetheart of sweethearts. 852 00:42:04,321 --> 00:42:08,893 Couldn't remember a line, but was a great guy. 853 00:42:08,993 --> 00:42:12,796 He was always looking for the lines somewhere. 854 00:42:12,897 --> 00:42:15,332 I would whisper a line to him, even on camera. 855 00:42:15,432 --> 00:42:18,903 - I am defending the right of this girl to be judged innocent 856 00:42:19,003 --> 00:42:20,771 until she is proved innocent. 857 00:42:20,871 --> 00:42:24,942 - After the show we'd go to this bar a couple of blocks away 858 00:42:25,042 --> 00:42:30,080 and he'd have about five or six vodkas and... 859 00:42:30,180 --> 00:42:32,016 He was a great dude, Jonny. 860 00:42:32,116 --> 00:42:34,818 He was a sweetheart, just a sweetheart. 861 00:42:36,754 --> 00:42:38,622 - He was definitely an actor who was 862 00:42:38,722 --> 00:42:40,224 critical of his performance. 863 00:42:40,324 --> 00:42:42,793 And he would sometimes go home at the end of the day thinking, 864 00:42:42,893 --> 00:42:45,362 oh, I wish I could have done that better. 865 00:42:45,462 --> 00:42:47,231 But there was a part of him that said, well, 866 00:42:47,331 --> 00:42:49,867 I get another chance tomorrow, there's another show tomorrow. 867 00:42:49,967 --> 00:42:53,270 And he didn't ever think the show would be rerun. 868 00:42:53,370 --> 00:42:55,773 He said, "It'll be aired once. 869 00:42:55,873 --> 00:42:56,941 It won't be seen again. 870 00:42:57,041 --> 00:42:57,908 All right, I'll get the opportunity 871 00:42:58,008 --> 00:42:59,677 to do another show." 872 00:42:59,777 --> 00:43:02,813 Little did he know that the show would go on and on and on. 873 00:43:02,913 --> 00:43:05,182 - It's hard to describe the success of that show, isn't it, 874 00:43:05,282 --> 00:43:06,917 Jonathan? - Yes, I must say it is. 875 00:43:07,017 --> 00:43:11,088 - What is the audience's fascination with the morbid? 876 00:43:11,188 --> 00:43:13,023 - I've really never been able to figure it out 877 00:43:13,123 --> 00:43:14,325 but I'm enjoying it immensely. 878 00:43:14,425 --> 00:43:16,093 But I've never been able to figure it out. 879 00:43:16,193 --> 00:43:17,761 - I get asked a lot, as if I'm somehow 880 00:43:17,861 --> 00:43:19,964 an expert on this, what is it about vampires 881 00:43:20,064 --> 00:43:24,234 that's attractive to people or women or youngsters? 882 00:43:24,335 --> 00:43:26,203 Ultimately, I think they're not dying thing. 883 00:43:26,303 --> 00:43:28,405 That's really attractive. I thought about it. 884 00:43:28,505 --> 00:43:31,942 And I thought, maybe it's a safe way 885 00:43:32,042 --> 00:43:37,214 to have a sort of fantasy of being taken. 886 00:43:37,314 --> 00:43:40,284 - I know what you are. 887 00:43:40,918 --> 00:43:44,221 - He presented that idea that you could 888 00:43:44,321 --> 00:43:45,856 be part of this Gothic love. 889 00:43:45,956 --> 00:43:47,291 "Is it you?" 890 00:43:47,391 --> 00:43:50,227 It was kind of wonderful because he'd bite somebody, 891 00:43:50,327 --> 00:43:53,163 and he tried really hard to look rough while he was biting 892 00:43:53,263 --> 00:43:54,898 but he didn't. 893 00:43:54,999 --> 00:43:57,234 He didn't look like he was going like rip your throat out. 894 00:43:57,334 --> 00:43:59,303 It was like, "Oh, yeah, I want you to bite me." 895 00:43:59,403 --> 00:44:01,939 - Jonathan, I'd be curious to know what 896 00:44:02,039 --> 00:44:03,974 your mail is like on that show? 897 00:44:04,074 --> 00:44:05,409 What do people write to you about? 898 00:44:05,509 --> 00:44:09,680 - Well, it gets rather exotic at times, I must say. 899 00:44:09,780 --> 00:44:11,915 - Is it sick mail or very appreciative? 900 00:44:12,016 --> 00:44:15,919 Do you recall any particular piece of mail that-- 901 00:44:16,020 --> 00:44:19,757 - Well, I think most of the mail that I find it amusing is 902 00:44:19,857 --> 00:44:23,861 the kind of mail from people who really get involved 903 00:44:23,961 --> 00:44:27,364 in the story, and they cannot imagine you as anybody else 904 00:44:27,464 --> 00:44:28,999 but the character you're playing. 905 00:44:29,099 --> 00:44:31,769 And even on tours I've been on, people come up to me 906 00:44:31,869 --> 00:44:35,205 and they really believe I'm a vampire. 907 00:44:35,305 --> 00:44:39,910 - Jonathan used to get tons of big bags of mail 908 00:44:40,010 --> 00:44:43,247 from women, pictures of themselves. 909 00:44:43,347 --> 00:44:45,249 It was crazy. 910 00:44:45,349 --> 00:44:47,017 They used to send him these pictures of-- 911 00:44:47,117 --> 00:44:50,087 nude pictures of themselves, all kinds of very sick stuff 912 00:44:50,187 --> 00:44:52,256 was going on. 913 00:44:52,956 --> 00:44:54,258 - You're going to die, Miss Trask? 914 00:44:54,358 --> 00:44:55,726 Do you realize that? 915 00:44:55,826 --> 00:44:57,928 - I will be with him. 916 00:44:58,028 --> 00:45:00,864 - It was really an incredible success. 917 00:45:00,964 --> 00:45:04,034 It could not have been anticipated in any way, 918 00:45:04,134 --> 00:45:07,471 and that when it did happen everybody reveled in it 919 00:45:07,571 --> 00:45:09,740 and worked hard. 920 00:45:10,174 --> 00:45:13,510 - We were a soap opera. 921 00:45:13,610 --> 00:45:16,447 And it was just phenomenal to have that kind of response. 922 00:45:16,547 --> 00:45:18,315 - It was way out in left field. 923 00:45:18,415 --> 00:45:20,284 It was revolutionary. 924 00:45:20,384 --> 00:45:24,088 - It changed the entire face of daytime television. 925 00:45:29,526 --> 00:45:33,430 - Committed to continuing the success of "Dark Shadows," ABC 926 00:45:33,530 --> 00:45:37,134 built a studio for the show at West 53rd Street, New York 927 00:45:37,234 --> 00:45:38,769 City. 928 00:45:38,869 --> 00:45:40,804 - I got a pretty good imagination. 929 00:45:40,904 --> 00:45:44,308 And I reached the point where I didn't know 930 00:45:44,408 --> 00:45:46,910 what I was going to do next. 931 00:45:47,010 --> 00:45:48,979 What kind of a story could I come up with 932 00:45:49,079 --> 00:45:50,214 and keep this guy going? 933 00:45:53,217 --> 00:45:55,052 - What's happening? 934 00:45:55,152 --> 00:45:56,520 - We're trapped! 935 00:45:56,620 --> 00:45:58,522 We're trapped in another time! 936 00:45:58,622 --> 00:46:01,325 - I was always fascinated by time travel. 937 00:46:01,425 --> 00:46:03,393 And I thought, "Well, wait a minute! 938 00:46:03,494 --> 00:46:07,297 Why don't we go back into the past 939 00:46:07,397 --> 00:46:11,368 and find out how Barnabas became a vampire?" 940 00:46:11,468 --> 00:46:15,372 - Your soul will never rest, Barnabas. 941 00:46:15,472 --> 00:46:18,208 - Wow, you talk about success. 942 00:46:18,308 --> 00:46:20,177 It was our most popular story. 943 00:46:20,277 --> 00:46:21,945 I never wanted to get out of the past. 944 00:46:22,045 --> 00:46:23,280 I stayed there forever. 945 00:46:23,380 --> 00:46:24,948 And the thing that was so wonderful about it 946 00:46:25,048 --> 00:46:28,118 is when Victoria was transported back through a seance-- 947 00:46:28,218 --> 00:46:29,953 that was my device-- 948 00:46:30,053 --> 00:46:32,189 and she walks into Collinwood-- or the old house, 949 00:46:32,289 --> 00:46:34,291 the way it was in those days-- 950 00:46:34,391 --> 00:46:36,960 and there are all the same actors playing different roles. 951 00:46:37,060 --> 00:46:38,962 The audience went nuts over that. 952 00:46:39,062 --> 00:46:40,164 They just loved that. 953 00:46:40,264 --> 00:46:42,132 - Why doesn't anybody know me? 954 00:46:50,140 --> 00:46:51,041 - Good evening. 955 00:46:51,141 --> 00:46:52,976 I'm Mrs. Collins. 956 00:46:53,076 --> 00:46:54,378 You must be the new governess. 957 00:46:54,478 --> 00:46:57,214 - The network executives told Dan 958 00:46:57,314 --> 00:46:59,082 this was not going to work, he needed 959 00:46:59,183 --> 00:47:01,418 to hire a different actress. And he said, "No, no." 960 00:47:01,518 --> 00:47:03,520 He said, "No, the audience will follow us. 961 00:47:03,620 --> 00:47:04,955 I trust them." 962 00:47:05,055 --> 00:47:06,290 And they did. 963 00:47:06,390 --> 00:47:07,891 - The biggest problem for me on "Dark Shadows" 964 00:47:07,991 --> 00:47:10,294 was to constantly come up with stories. 965 00:47:10,394 --> 00:47:12,496 And I thought, wouldn't it to be great 966 00:47:12,596 --> 00:47:15,933 if I could bring in another character that was equally as 967 00:47:16,033 --> 00:47:20,304 popular as Barnabas so that every story didn't have 968 00:47:20,404 --> 00:47:22,973 to be tied to the vampire? 969 00:47:23,073 --> 00:47:25,142 Which was the problem with the show. 970 00:47:25,242 --> 00:47:29,313 Because if you didn't have the vampire operating as a vampire, 971 00:47:29,413 --> 00:47:31,982 the audience wasn't very happy. 972 00:47:32,082 --> 00:47:35,118 So it was a true challenge to try and find 973 00:47:35,219 --> 00:47:37,187 something else that really worked. 974 00:47:37,287 --> 00:47:38,188 - Hi, Quentin. 975 00:47:42,526 --> 00:47:44,661 - They said, come over to the studio the next day. 976 00:47:44,761 --> 00:47:46,430 So I did. 977 00:47:46,530 --> 00:47:53,904 And all they did was look at me on camera and that was it. 978 00:47:54,004 --> 00:47:55,472 And then that's when they told me 979 00:47:55,572 --> 00:48:00,010 that I wasn't going to speak for the first few shows. 980 00:48:00,110 --> 00:48:04,181 - Aren't you going to say something, Quentin? 981 00:48:04,281 --> 00:48:08,385 - Did you imagine doing a show with ghosts and vampires? 982 00:48:08,485 --> 00:48:09,553 No. 983 00:48:09,653 --> 00:48:13,190 Nor did I ever imagine in the world 984 00:48:13,290 --> 00:48:16,326 that I would be playing a werewolf. 985 00:48:16,426 --> 00:48:17,561 I can't... 986 00:48:22,666 --> 00:48:23,967 - I love a werewolf. 987 00:48:24,067 --> 00:48:25,636 And I just think, sometimes you just 988 00:48:25,736 --> 00:48:28,105 have to take people as they are. 989 00:48:28,205 --> 00:48:29,273 You just have to accept them. 990 00:48:29,373 --> 00:48:31,141 I would have taken that bite also. 991 00:48:31,241 --> 00:48:33,076 Just saying. 992 00:48:35,112 --> 00:48:37,180 - Somebody mentioned to me that there was going 993 00:48:37,281 --> 00:48:40,083 to be a song, a theme song. 994 00:48:40,183 --> 00:48:42,653 And every time the character appeared, 995 00:48:42,753 --> 00:48:45,422 there would be this music. 996 00:48:45,522 --> 00:48:48,492 - It's such pretty music, isn't it, David? 997 00:48:48,592 --> 00:48:50,994 - Once again, I got a call from Dan. 998 00:48:51,094 --> 00:48:52,329 "Cobert, you've got to come down. 999 00:48:52,429 --> 00:48:53,563 I got a new spook. 1000 00:48:53,664 --> 00:48:55,032 I got a new spook coming on the show. 1001 00:48:55,132 --> 00:48:56,366 His name is Quentin. 1002 00:48:56,466 --> 00:49:00,003 And he first appears out of an old phonograph. 1003 00:49:00,103 --> 00:49:03,006 And we hear this music, which will be Quentin's theme." 1004 00:49:03,106 --> 00:49:04,241 And then he said, "Well, how long 1005 00:49:04,341 --> 00:49:05,475 is this going to take you?" 1006 00:49:05,575 --> 00:49:07,077 And I said, "Would you like to hear it 1007 00:49:07,177 --> 00:49:09,379 in about 30 seconds or so?" And he looked at me. 1008 00:49:09,479 --> 00:49:10,380 He said, "Come on, Cobe. 1009 00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:11,448 What are you, kidding me?" 1010 00:49:11,548 --> 00:49:12,516 I said, "No." 1011 00:49:12,616 --> 00:49:23,460 [singing quentin's theme] 1012 00:49:23,560 --> 00:49:25,228 He said, "Oh, my God! I love it! 1013 00:49:25,329 --> 00:49:26,363 That's gorgeous! 1014 00:49:26,463 --> 00:49:27,698 That's fantastic." 1015 00:49:27,798 --> 00:49:29,700 He said, "It sounds familiar." 1016 00:49:29,800 --> 00:49:32,035 I said, "Yeah, it should sound familiar. 1017 00:49:32,135 --> 00:49:34,805 I wrote it for Billie Whitelaw in our 'Jekyll and Hyde.'" 1018 00:49:38,675 --> 00:49:39,576 - Hey. 1019 00:49:39,676 --> 00:49:41,545 Did your friend warn you? 1020 00:49:41,645 --> 00:49:43,013 - Jekyll? 1021 00:49:43,113 --> 00:49:44,181 He isn't here tonight. 1022 00:49:44,281 --> 00:49:45,449 I looked. 1023 00:49:45,549 --> 00:49:47,517 - Well, he's brought some reinforcements. 1024 00:49:54,124 --> 00:49:55,525 - That music... 1025 00:49:55,625 --> 00:49:57,027 - It's his! 1026 00:49:57,127 --> 00:49:58,428 - I called my dad. 1027 00:49:58,528 --> 00:50:02,366 And I said, "Dad, I got my theme song! 1028 00:50:02,466 --> 00:50:03,800 I've got a theme song." 1029 00:50:10,140 --> 00:50:13,210 And then they wrote words for it, "Shadows of the Night." 1030 00:50:13,310 --> 00:50:23,720 - Shadows of the night, calling me to you. 1031 00:50:23,820 --> 00:50:25,322 - Biggest hit song to ever come out 1032 00:50:25,422 --> 00:50:28,759 of daytime television, possibly the only hit song 1033 00:50:28,859 --> 00:50:31,261 to ever come out of daytime television. 1034 00:50:31,361 --> 00:50:34,531 One of the few major hits to come out 1035 00:50:34,631 --> 00:50:37,234 of any kind of television. 1036 00:50:37,334 --> 00:50:42,339 And the LP that came out featuring Quentin's theme 1037 00:50:42,439 --> 00:50:45,142 was the second highest selling LP 1038 00:50:45,242 --> 00:50:47,411 from television of all times. 1039 00:50:47,511 --> 00:50:49,513 - And I know that Quentin's theme 1040 00:50:49,613 --> 00:50:51,448 was recorded by several people. 1041 00:50:51,548 --> 00:50:54,451 There were a lot of different orchestrations of it. 1042 00:50:54,551 --> 00:50:55,719 I guess it did fine. 1043 00:50:55,819 --> 00:50:57,354 - Sold lots of records. 1044 00:50:57,454 --> 00:50:59,489 Come on, made a lot of money. 1045 00:50:59,589 --> 00:51:02,159 Let's not be shy about this. 1046 00:51:14,404 --> 00:51:16,473 - It was a respite to go to the studio 1047 00:51:16,573 --> 00:51:20,444 because of what was going on around us with the Vietnam War, 1048 00:51:20,544 --> 00:51:24,648 with the Kennedy assassination, the Martin Luther King 1049 00:51:24,748 --> 00:51:28,151 assassination, with the political situation. 1050 00:51:28,251 --> 00:51:29,786 It was a difficult time. 1051 00:51:29,886 --> 00:51:32,756 - "By 1967, more than 100 Americans 1052 00:51:32,856 --> 00:51:34,825 were dying each week in Vietnam." 1053 00:51:34,925 --> 00:51:38,595 - It was a way to in many ways escape 1054 00:51:38,695 --> 00:51:41,665 the pressures of America, especially for teenagers. 1055 00:51:41,765 --> 00:51:44,701 Teenagers obviously had older siblings 1056 00:51:44,801 --> 00:51:46,803 who were involved in either the war 1057 00:51:46,903 --> 00:51:48,472 effort or the anti-war effort. 1058 00:51:48,572 --> 00:51:51,608 There was a great division in almost every family. 1059 00:51:51,708 --> 00:51:54,377 And I think the kids especially who 1060 00:51:54,478 --> 00:51:56,913 really were getting a little tired 1061 00:51:57,013 --> 00:52:00,150 of this continuing debate in the family, 1062 00:52:00,250 --> 00:52:02,586 where you politically stand, this was a way 1063 00:52:02,686 --> 00:52:06,490 to sort of see the world anew, but it also sort of brought you 1064 00:52:06,590 --> 00:52:08,525 back into the world, too, the idea of the world 1065 00:52:08,625 --> 00:52:10,293 seemed possessed. 1066 00:52:10,393 --> 00:52:14,464 There seemed to be demons loose in America in the late '60s. 1067 00:52:14,564 --> 00:52:17,367 But here, it was a way to look at a world possessed but maybe 1068 00:52:17,467 --> 00:52:20,837 not as anxiety feeling as the real world was. 1069 00:52:20,937 --> 00:52:25,275 - We would go inside this studio and create this other world. 1070 00:52:25,375 --> 00:52:30,280 And I think to a certain extent, people loved that other world. 1071 00:52:37,921 --> 00:52:40,924 - Harry and I went to Europe every year. 1072 00:52:41,024 --> 00:52:45,495 Mainly, we would go to London first or London at the end. 1073 00:52:45,595 --> 00:52:48,398 They had wonderful secondhand bookshops. 1074 00:52:48,498 --> 00:52:54,304 And I used to bring a lot of stuff back to the office. 1075 00:52:54,404 --> 00:52:58,575 Gave them a lot of horror material. 1076 00:52:58,675 --> 00:53:02,746 - Horror is a very rich source to steal from. 1077 00:53:02,846 --> 00:53:06,216 - "Dark Shadows" was not shy about borrowing plots 1078 00:53:06,316 --> 00:53:07,684 from other places. 1079 00:53:07,784 --> 00:53:12,756 - "The Turn of the Screw," "Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde," 1080 00:53:12,856 --> 00:53:15,292 "Dracula," of course, the Frankenstein story, 1081 00:53:15,392 --> 00:53:17,294 "Jane Eyre," "Wuthering Heights." 1082 00:53:17,394 --> 00:53:20,397 - There was one thing that we missed, I think, 1083 00:53:20,497 --> 00:53:21,631 and that was mummies. 1084 00:53:21,731 --> 00:53:25,001 But other than that, we hit them all. 1085 00:53:25,735 --> 00:53:27,871 - I have the witch! 1086 00:53:30,040 --> 00:53:33,009 - At one point, some viewer wrote to Dan 1087 00:53:33,109 --> 00:53:35,512 and he said, "You don't have a staff of writers, 1088 00:53:35,612 --> 00:53:37,314 you've got a den of thieves." 1089 00:53:37,414 --> 00:53:39,382 - He used to say, this is not-- 1090 00:53:39,482 --> 00:53:41,718 "Dark Shadows" is not horror. 1091 00:53:41,818 --> 00:53:45,021 "Dark Shadows" is Gothic romance. 1092 00:53:45,121 --> 00:53:46,489 - No. 1093 00:53:46,590 --> 00:53:48,024 This is insane. 1094 00:53:48,124 --> 00:53:49,793 - I used to read the scripts, obviously, 1095 00:53:49,893 --> 00:53:52,329 ahead of time when we got them. 1096 00:53:52,429 --> 00:53:54,898 And I would scratch my head on certain things and go, 1097 00:53:54,998 --> 00:53:58,034 I have no idea how we're going to pull this off. 1098 00:53:58,134 --> 00:54:00,704 - With five half hour slots a week to fill, 1099 00:54:00,804 --> 00:54:03,440 producing a steady flow of surprises 1100 00:54:03,540 --> 00:54:06,509 was an arduous task for Dan and his writers. 1101 00:54:06,610 --> 00:54:10,814 - Ron Sproat used to have very long sessions with 1102 00:54:10,914 --> 00:54:12,949 Dan Curtis about plotting the show. 1103 00:54:13,049 --> 00:54:14,684 They were legendary. 1104 00:54:14,784 --> 00:54:19,389 - We actually had 24 hour story sessions. 1105 00:54:19,489 --> 00:54:22,659 And we'd leave the place at 9 AM-- 1106 00:54:22,759 --> 00:54:25,962 went in at 9 AM, came out at 9 AM the next morning. 1107 00:54:26,062 --> 00:54:29,499 Of course, we wanted to get a couple of weeks work laid out 1108 00:54:29,599 --> 00:54:32,602 so we can go and write them instead of meeting every week. 1109 00:54:32,702 --> 00:54:35,772 - The sessions with Dan could be grueling. 1110 00:54:35,872 --> 00:54:38,308 He would putt golf balls. 1111 00:54:38,408 --> 00:54:41,611 He even had a wall to wall green carpet. 1112 00:54:41,711 --> 00:54:46,783 And so he would just constantly putt that ball back and forth 1113 00:54:46,883 --> 00:54:49,753 and then he would talk and while he was doing it. 1114 00:54:49,853 --> 00:54:52,322 - I've seen writers come out of interviews with him 1115 00:54:52,422 --> 00:54:53,356 with their knees shaking. 1116 00:54:53,456 --> 00:54:54,391 He scares them to death. 1117 00:54:54,491 --> 00:54:55,792 He had those penetrating eyes. 1118 00:54:55,892 --> 00:54:58,328 He would say, "All right, send in this asshole." 1119 00:54:58,428 --> 00:55:00,830 He said, "Send him in." And so they'd send him in. 1120 00:55:00,930 --> 00:55:02,632 "Tell this asshole that if he doesn't 1121 00:55:02,732 --> 00:55:04,968 drop this idea of wanting more money, 1122 00:55:05,068 --> 00:55:08,805 I am going to go out of my office and go down the corridor 1123 00:55:08,905 --> 00:55:11,775 and get in the elevator and go down to the first floor 1124 00:55:11,875 --> 00:55:13,877 and walk across the street to his office 1125 00:55:13,977 --> 00:55:15,945 and tear his fucking face off." 1126 00:55:16,046 --> 00:55:17,847 If you gave him anything less than your best, 1127 00:55:17,947 --> 00:55:20,884 he did not appreciate that and would not use you again. 1128 00:55:20,984 --> 00:55:23,520 - He was an artist and a real artist because he kept saying, 1129 00:55:23,620 --> 00:55:24,788 how can we make it better? 1130 00:55:24,888 --> 00:55:26,556 What can we do to make it better? 1131 00:55:26,656 --> 00:55:29,726 How can we-- to keep challenging himself and to challenge us. 1132 00:55:29,826 --> 00:55:32,128 - You start trying to plot and you 1133 00:55:32,228 --> 00:55:34,064 think the most stupid things. 1134 00:55:34,164 --> 00:55:36,433 And I remember Dan Curtis literally 1135 00:55:36,533 --> 00:55:39,936 falling out of his chair and rolling on the floor. 1136 00:55:40,036 --> 00:55:41,137 It was a good time. 1137 00:55:44,107 --> 00:55:46,443 - One of the reasons I liked writing for "Dark Shadows" 1138 00:55:46,543 --> 00:55:48,411 is that I could be shameless and could just 1139 00:55:48,511 --> 00:55:51,147 do shameless things that you couldn't do any place else. 1140 00:55:51,247 --> 00:55:52,849 You could really stick it to 'em. 1141 00:55:52,949 --> 00:55:55,051 - Make them my servants... 1142 00:55:55,151 --> 00:55:56,853 Now! 1143 00:55:56,953 --> 00:55:58,822 - While the writers scoured all corners 1144 00:55:58,922 --> 00:56:01,524 of Gothic and supernatural lore to maintain the show's 1145 00:56:01,624 --> 00:56:03,993 rapid pace, in turn the special effects crew 1146 00:56:04,094 --> 00:56:06,029 were on call more frequently than one would 1147 00:56:06,129 --> 00:56:08,431 expect on a daytime drama. 1148 00:56:08,531 --> 00:56:10,500 - Kitty? 1149 00:56:10,600 --> 00:56:14,604 - Back in 1966, special effects were very primitive. 1150 00:56:14,704 --> 00:56:17,173 One of our special effects was a paper bat 1151 00:56:17,273 --> 00:56:20,577 hanging on a fish line and a prop man 1152 00:56:20,677 --> 00:56:21,945 jiggled a fishing pole. 1153 00:56:22,045 --> 00:56:24,514 That was our scary bat. 1154 00:56:24,614 --> 00:56:26,116 - I remember when my head was chopped off 1155 00:56:26,216 --> 00:56:31,688 and it rolled across the floor as this one character, 1156 00:56:31,788 --> 00:56:32,689 and it was so funny. 1157 00:56:36,059 --> 00:56:37,827 And I just couldn't stop laughing. 1158 00:56:37,927 --> 00:56:39,629 And nobody could stop laughing. 1159 00:56:39,729 --> 00:56:44,667 And Dan finally said, cut, cut-- which he rarely cut. 1160 00:56:44,768 --> 00:56:46,069 Rarely cut. 1161 00:56:46,169 --> 00:56:49,038 You had to do something like this for him to cut. 1162 00:56:49,139 --> 00:56:53,543 And he goes, "Hey, Rog, don't break up, OK?" 1163 00:56:53,643 --> 00:56:54,544 - Please. 1164 00:56:54,644 --> 00:56:56,646 - I ordered you to go. 1165 00:56:56,746 --> 00:56:58,014 Now! 1166 00:56:58,114 --> 00:57:00,083 - I mean, the hand coming out of the grave 1167 00:57:00,183 --> 00:57:05,054 was literally a prop guy lying on his back underneath. 1168 00:57:05,155 --> 00:57:07,123 I remember my favorite note was, "Kathryn, 1169 00:57:07,223 --> 00:57:09,058 when you see the hand coming out of the grave, 1170 00:57:09,159 --> 00:57:12,495 turn to camera three and scream." 1171 00:57:12,595 --> 00:57:15,965 - The vampire would say, "Come to me for comfort. 1172 00:57:16,065 --> 00:57:17,600 I need you." 1173 00:57:17,700 --> 00:57:19,035 And then the other person would go... 1174 00:57:22,238 --> 00:57:25,675 While they were doing that, you're 1175 00:57:25,775 --> 00:57:28,611 putting in your teeth, which were fitted. 1176 00:57:28,711 --> 00:57:29,946 They were made by the dentist. 1177 00:57:30,046 --> 00:57:31,681 They are fitted right on our own eye teeth. 1178 00:57:31,781 --> 00:57:33,917 And then the camera would come back to you and you'd go-- 1179 00:57:37,587 --> 00:57:41,090 It turned out a little campy because when you have a ghost 1180 00:57:41,191 --> 00:57:44,227 coming out of his grave and he's covered with blood and bandages 1181 00:57:44,327 --> 00:57:46,663 and... 1182 00:57:46,763 --> 00:57:48,565 you just can't help but think it's funny. 1183 00:57:48,665 --> 00:57:52,769 But on the other hand, we played it entirely as 1184 00:57:52,869 --> 00:57:54,904 though it were really, really happening. 1185 00:57:55,004 --> 00:58:00,076 - You must learn what it is to live in the land of the dead. 1186 00:58:00,176 --> 00:58:03,813 - I'm really amazed that the shows came on that well. 1187 00:58:03,913 --> 00:58:06,749 I mean, we're known for our bloopers, I know, 1188 00:58:06,850 --> 00:58:10,620 for the shaky scenery and all of that sort of thing. 1189 00:58:10,720 --> 00:58:14,624 - I 'spect you're wondering what I'm doing here, eh? 1190 00:58:14,724 --> 00:58:18,127 - No, I'm glad you're here. 1191 00:58:18,228 --> 00:58:21,064 - Frankly, considering the circumstances 1192 00:58:21,164 --> 00:58:24,100 we were working under, starting at 8:00 in the morning 1193 00:58:24,200 --> 00:58:28,972 and doing our show live at 3:30? 1194 00:58:29,072 --> 00:58:30,139 Pretty amazing. 1195 00:58:30,240 --> 00:58:33,676 - Tell them that you saw no one here. 1196 00:58:33,776 --> 00:58:34,711 - Oh, that's fine. 1197 00:58:34,811 --> 00:58:36,880 What am I going to tell them? 1198 00:58:36,980 --> 00:58:38,047 - That you saw no one here! 1199 00:58:38,147 --> 00:58:39,816 - The mistakes that you were making, 1200 00:58:39,916 --> 00:58:41,751 because of the limited budget a lot of times 1201 00:58:41,851 --> 00:58:44,020 you weren't going back and reshooting it. 1202 00:58:44,120 --> 00:58:45,855 The most famous one from "Dark Shadows" 1203 00:58:45,955 --> 00:58:49,058 is there's a credit crawl at the end of one episode where 1204 00:58:49,158 --> 00:58:52,028 you actually see Jonathan Frid, who played Barnabas, 1205 00:58:52,128 --> 00:58:54,797 walking across the screen holding his shoes. 1206 00:58:54,898 --> 00:58:57,233 - It's just like being in summer stock and doing a play. 1207 00:58:57,333 --> 00:58:59,769 Things went wrong, the boom would come into the shot, 1208 00:58:59,869 --> 00:59:02,772 or the prop man would be running across and back. 1209 00:59:02,872 --> 00:59:04,307 Or I'd walk through the graveyard 1210 00:59:04,407 --> 00:59:06,109 and the gravestones were all Styrofoam 1211 00:59:06,209 --> 00:59:08,144 so I'd knock them over with my dress. 1212 00:59:08,244 --> 00:59:11,114 - The camera bumping over a cable, so the shot kind of 1213 00:59:11,214 --> 00:59:12,582 goes up and down. 1214 00:59:12,682 --> 00:59:14,150 - Several of my incestors-- 1215 00:59:14,250 --> 00:59:17,220 incestors-- my ancestors are buried here. 1216 00:59:17,320 --> 00:59:18,821 - After one of those shows, you'd 1217 00:59:18,922 --> 00:59:21,758 go to your dressing room and burst into tears 1218 00:59:21,858 --> 00:59:26,062 and then beg for another chance, just this once can we redo it? 1219 00:59:26,162 --> 00:59:28,064 And Dan would say, "No! Why? 1220 00:59:28,164 --> 00:59:29,766 He said, "This is going to be seen once 1221 00:59:29,866 --> 00:59:30,900 by a bunch of housewives. 1222 00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:32,001 Who cares?" 1223 00:59:32,101 --> 00:59:34,604 - You know what to do, Vicki-- 1224 00:59:34,704 --> 00:59:36,239 you know what to do now, Julia. 1225 00:59:36,339 --> 00:59:38,207 - It was like a repertory company. 1226 00:59:38,308 --> 00:59:40,910 - Seems to me that-- 1227 00:59:41,010 --> 00:59:44,180 - I would advise you not to make a move. 1228 00:59:44,280 --> 00:59:47,116 - But Dan was... 1229 00:59:47,216 --> 00:59:48,918 He was a force. 1230 00:59:49,018 --> 00:59:51,020 - The actors adored him. 1231 00:59:51,120 --> 00:59:52,722 They loved his direction. 1232 00:59:52,822 --> 00:59:54,624 They loved the way he treated them. 1233 00:59:54,724 --> 00:59:55,925 - He was always on my side. 1234 00:59:56,025 --> 00:59:59,362 And I really was incredibly indebted to him. 1235 00:59:59,462 --> 01:00:01,798 - I got along with him just fine because he 1236 01:00:01,898 --> 01:00:03,633 loved my sense of humor and I loved his 1237 01:00:03,733 --> 01:00:05,401 and we'd make each other laugh a lot. 1238 01:00:05,501 --> 01:00:09,038 - If you were in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean in a leaky 1239 01:00:09,138 --> 01:00:12,208 rowboat with one oar, 1240 01:00:12,241 --> 01:00:14,310 you would want Dan Curtis in that boat 1241 01:00:14,344 --> 01:00:18,281 with you because he would figure out a way to save your neck 1242 01:00:18,381 --> 01:00:19,282 and get you to shore. 1243 01:00:22,852 --> 01:00:25,755 - By this point, Dan Curtis had set his sights 1244 01:00:25,855 --> 01:00:30,693 beyond television and was poised to make a leap into movies. 1245 01:00:30,793 --> 01:00:33,129 The choice of his first feature was obvious-- 1246 01:00:33,229 --> 01:00:35,898 a spin-off of "Dark Shadows." 1247 01:00:37,166 --> 01:00:40,670 - I command you to come to me! 1248 01:00:40,770 --> 01:00:44,440 - "Barnabas Collins, vampire, 1249 01:00:44,540 --> 01:00:49,746 takes a bride in a bizarre act of unnatural love. 1250 01:00:52,115 --> 01:00:58,354 Come and see how the vampires do it." 1251 01:00:59,088 --> 01:01:03,226 - When Dan prepared "House of Dark Shadows," 1252 01:01:03,326 --> 01:01:06,195 he took the basic premise of the series 1253 01:01:06,295 --> 01:01:10,833 but he went to a more traditional vampire, a vampire 1254 01:01:10,933 --> 01:01:14,203 who was really evil and deserved to get a stake in his heart 1255 01:01:14,303 --> 01:01:15,872 at the end. 1256 01:01:15,972 --> 01:01:18,307 - They weren't making Barnabas a reluctant vampire. 1257 01:01:18,408 --> 01:01:21,010 And I mentioned that to Dan. 1258 01:01:21,110 --> 01:01:24,480 I said, "You're not making him vulnerable. 1259 01:01:24,580 --> 01:01:26,149 You're not making him reluctant." 1260 01:01:26,249 --> 01:01:28,951 And he looked at me in a very-- he said, "No, we're not 1261 01:01:29,052 --> 01:01:30,386 doing it that way this time." 1262 01:01:30,486 --> 01:01:34,190 - "'House of Dark Shadows.' 1263 01:01:37,927 --> 01:01:41,864 Where death is a way of life." 1264 01:01:41,964 --> 01:01:43,733 - And we got to do another take. 1265 01:01:43,833 --> 01:01:45,735 And they stopped and they relit you 1266 01:01:45,835 --> 01:01:49,005 so that you were doing a close up with different lighting. 1267 01:01:49,105 --> 01:01:52,175 My goodness, I thought I'd died and gone to heaven. 1268 01:01:52,275 --> 01:01:54,010 - He loved directing. 1269 01:01:54,110 --> 01:01:55,945 He was just a kid in a candy shop. 1270 01:01:56,045 --> 01:01:58,214 He was having a wonderful time. 1271 01:01:59,315 --> 01:02:03,886 - "House of Dark Shadows" was an unexpected hit for MGM. 1272 01:02:03,986 --> 01:02:07,323 The studio green lit a sequel almost immediately. 1273 01:02:07,423 --> 01:02:10,293 However, this did not sit well with everyone. 1274 01:02:11,394 --> 01:02:13,429 Jonathan was ultimately disappointed 1275 01:02:13,529 --> 01:02:16,999 when he saw the movie because it had so much more the blood, 1276 01:02:17,100 --> 01:02:18,167 the gore. 1277 01:02:18,267 --> 01:02:20,169 So he was disappointed and told Dan 1278 01:02:20,269 --> 01:02:22,371 he didn't want to do the second movie. 1279 01:02:22,472 --> 01:02:24,874 And Dan wasn't happy about that. 1280 01:02:26,542 --> 01:02:28,945 - And he said, "I don't think playing 1281 01:02:29,045 --> 01:02:31,447 a vampire is good for my image. 1282 01:02:31,547 --> 01:02:33,516 A number of my friends have said to me 1283 01:02:33,616 --> 01:02:36,786 they don't think this is good for my career." 1284 01:02:36,886 --> 01:02:40,289 And I can still remember saying to him, "What about the image 1285 01:02:40,389 --> 01:02:42,058 of an out of work actor? 1286 01:02:42,158 --> 01:02:43,926 Is that better?" 1287 01:02:45,128 --> 01:02:47,430 - I believe that there was a wedge that 1288 01:02:47,530 --> 01:02:50,900 came between them because he obviously had 1289 01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:52,435 to create a whole new script. 1290 01:02:52,535 --> 01:02:57,273 - "Come back to Collinwood, that house of dark shadows, 1291 01:02:57,373 --> 01:03:01,577 where life and death go on as usual. 1292 01:03:02,445 --> 01:03:05,481 'Night of Dark Shadows.'" 1293 01:03:06,949 --> 01:03:09,118 - "Night of Dark Shadows" proved less successful 1294 01:03:09,218 --> 01:03:11,354 at the box office. 1295 01:03:11,988 --> 01:03:15,324 - After the movie, I didn't know what else I was going to do. 1296 01:03:15,424 --> 01:03:17,093 I couldn't think of another idea. 1297 01:03:17,193 --> 01:03:19,595 But then we started getting into things like the Leviathan 1298 01:03:19,695 --> 01:03:21,397 and stuff like that. 1299 01:03:21,497 --> 01:03:24,233 I was becoming very disenchanted right along with the audience. 1300 01:03:24,333 --> 01:03:26,235 I was just hoping it was going to end. 1301 01:03:26,335 --> 01:03:27,436 I just wanted to move on. 1302 01:03:27,537 --> 01:03:30,072 I couldn't squeeze my brain any harder 1303 01:03:30,173 --> 01:03:32,308 to come up with one more story. 1304 01:03:32,408 --> 01:03:35,178 - Come to me. 1305 01:03:35,278 --> 01:03:37,113 Come to me. 1306 01:03:37,213 --> 01:03:39,315 We shall share eternity. 1307 01:03:39,415 --> 01:03:41,951 - As the show got more complicated, 1308 01:03:42,051 --> 01:03:45,121 I think that we may have started losing a few audience 1309 01:03:45,221 --> 01:03:46,355 members then. 1310 01:03:46,455 --> 01:03:48,324 - We weren't working with Dan anymore. 1311 01:03:48,424 --> 01:03:50,193 And we weren't that good. 1312 01:03:50,293 --> 01:03:52,028 We weren't. 1313 01:03:52,128 --> 01:03:56,265 As I mentioned before, we needed Dan. 1314 01:03:56,365 --> 01:04:02,338 And without him there riding herd, the show suffered. 1315 01:04:02,438 --> 01:04:08,044 - Dan used to say, when asked why did you 1316 01:04:08,144 --> 01:04:10,112 stop "Dark Shadows"? 1317 01:04:10,213 --> 01:04:13,983 And he goes, "Simple. 1318 01:04:14,083 --> 01:04:16,519 We ran out of things for Barnabas to bite." 1319 01:04:16,619 --> 01:04:19,288 - So I was out in the middle of a wardrobe fitting 1320 01:04:19,388 --> 01:04:21,457 and I got the news that, don't bother, 1321 01:04:21,557 --> 01:04:23,559 they've canceled the show. 1322 01:04:24,193 --> 01:04:26,128 - "And for as long as they lived, 1323 01:04:26,229 --> 01:04:29,498 the dark shadows at Collinwood were but a memory 1324 01:04:29,599 --> 01:04:31,500 of a distant past." 1325 01:04:31,601 --> 01:04:38,374 - Collinwood quietly shuttered its doors on April 2, 1971. 1326 01:04:39,709 --> 01:04:41,344 - But the irony of this whole thing, 1327 01:04:41,444 --> 01:04:43,446 that "Dark Shadows" is actually one of the shortest 1328 01:04:43,546 --> 01:04:45,214 lived soap operas ever. 1329 01:04:45,314 --> 01:04:47,950 But then, of course, one good reason for that 1330 01:04:48,050 --> 01:04:50,386 is because it dealt with specific material 1331 01:04:50,486 --> 01:04:52,154 and we ran out of material. 1332 01:04:52,255 --> 01:04:55,057 I mean, there are only about a dozen classic horror stories 1333 01:04:55,157 --> 01:04:57,226 and we did them once and twice over. 1334 01:04:57,326 --> 01:04:59,495 - "Dark Shadows" is not that much different 1335 01:04:59,595 --> 01:05:01,597 from most hot things in American culture, 1336 01:05:01,697 --> 01:05:04,433 whether it's music, film, or television. 1337 01:05:04,533 --> 01:05:05,601 There's an intensity. 1338 01:05:05,701 --> 01:05:08,004 But then, obviously, teenagers age. 1339 01:05:08,104 --> 01:05:09,472 They go to college. 1340 01:05:09,572 --> 01:05:15,011 And you had that great period of teenagers, 14 to 18, 1341 01:05:15,111 --> 01:05:17,580 but they will mature and they will go on to something else. 1342 01:05:17,680 --> 01:05:19,315 - Then we just went on with our lives. 1343 01:05:19,415 --> 01:05:22,151 I mean, I was very young. 1344 01:05:22,251 --> 01:05:25,988 I went to California to become a movie star, 1345 01:05:26,756 --> 01:05:30,293 not realizing that the best role I would ever get 1346 01:05:30,393 --> 01:05:32,161 would be Angelique. 1347 01:05:34,163 --> 01:05:36,966 - Though Jonathan Frid continued to work, 1348 01:05:37,066 --> 01:05:39,635 the roles he was offered were not always to his liking. 1349 01:05:39,735 --> 01:05:42,238 - He actually got a new agent right 1350 01:05:42,338 --> 01:05:44,240 towards the end of "Dark Shadows" 1351 01:05:44,340 --> 01:05:47,009 and they immediately said we're going to send you out to all 1352 01:05:47,109 --> 01:05:48,177 these different projects. 1353 01:05:48,277 --> 01:05:49,445 And they were horror movies. 1354 01:05:49,545 --> 01:05:51,247 He did the "Devil's Daughter." and then 1355 01:05:51,347 --> 01:05:54,550 he did Oliver Stone's directorial debut, "Seizure." 1356 01:05:54,650 --> 01:05:57,186 - "You can never hide from it. 1357 01:05:57,286 --> 01:06:02,491 The breath-stopping panic of 'Seizure.'" 1358 01:06:02,591 --> 01:06:06,696 - He had found Barnabas a multifaceted character and yet 1359 01:06:06,796 --> 01:06:10,633 casting people were saying, "Oh, do your thing, Mr. Frid! 1360 01:06:10,733 --> 01:06:12,134 He said, "What thing? 1361 01:06:12,234 --> 01:06:13,469 I didn't have a vampire thing. 1362 01:06:13,569 --> 01:06:16,539 I was an actor playing a very varied character." 1363 01:06:16,639 --> 01:06:18,040 There was definitely frustration. 1364 01:06:18,140 --> 01:06:23,212 So he decided to take a break from acting. 1365 01:06:23,846 --> 01:06:27,049 - Meanwhile, Curtis encountered a similar frustration, 1366 01:06:27,149 --> 01:06:28,484 finding that the majority of projects 1367 01:06:28,584 --> 01:06:29,785 he was able to get off the ground 1368 01:06:29,885 --> 01:06:31,687 returned into the realm of horror. 1369 01:06:31,787 --> 01:06:34,357 - What's kind of interesting to me about Dan Curtis post "Dark 1370 01:06:34,457 --> 01:06:36,759 Shadows" is that if you think about that period 1371 01:06:36,859 --> 01:06:41,697 in the '70s, I think Dan Curtis pretty much defined television 1372 01:06:41,797 --> 01:06:45,401 horror in that period, when he did those classic adaptations 1373 01:06:45,501 --> 01:06:47,536 with Frankenstein and Dracula. 1374 01:06:47,636 --> 01:06:50,439 - "A terrifying love story that reaches 1375 01:06:50,539 --> 01:06:51,707 back into the dead past." 1376 01:06:54,677 --> 01:06:57,780 - And then "Night Stalker" and the two films. 1377 01:06:57,880 --> 01:06:59,382 Particularly the first one, I think, 1378 01:06:59,482 --> 01:07:02,184 were very successful from a ratings perspective. 1379 01:07:02,284 --> 01:07:04,053 I mean, "Trilogy of Terror" is another thing 1380 01:07:04,153 --> 01:07:06,455 with an incredible shelf-life. 1381 01:07:07,156 --> 01:07:09,692 - He felt that he was trapped in the genre, as a matter of fact. 1382 01:07:09,792 --> 01:07:11,193 He said, "You can't get out. 1383 01:07:11,293 --> 01:07:12,762 If you do well, the better you do, 1384 01:07:12,862 --> 01:07:15,231 the more they want you to do more of the same kind of thing. 1385 01:07:15,331 --> 01:07:17,099 And I'm tired of doing that stuff," he said. 1386 01:07:17,199 --> 01:07:18,501 "I've scared enough people." 1387 01:07:19,735 --> 01:07:23,072 - "In this old house, something lives. 1388 01:07:23,172 --> 01:07:24,306 Something strange. 1389 01:07:24,407 --> 01:07:25,674 Something evil. 1390 01:07:28,677 --> 01:07:31,280 'Burnt Offerings.'" 1391 01:07:31,380 --> 01:07:33,716 - I think that he had wanted to move on 1392 01:07:33,816 --> 01:07:37,153 and he had been there, done that successfully. 1393 01:07:37,253 --> 01:07:39,188 He was ready to try something new. 1394 01:07:39,288 --> 01:07:42,224 - Something shifted, I think, inside of him 1395 01:07:42,324 --> 01:07:45,628 where he really wanted to do things with more meaning. 1396 01:07:46,262 --> 01:07:48,664 - Dan convinced writer Herman Wouk 1397 01:07:48,764 --> 01:07:52,768 to sell the rights to his epic novel, "The Winds of War." 1398 01:07:52,868 --> 01:07:55,538 So began a colossal three year production 1399 01:07:55,638 --> 01:07:58,707 in six countries with a cast of thousands. 1400 01:07:58,808 --> 01:08:01,744 - Dan started out by saying, "The book is 1401 01:08:01,844 --> 01:08:03,546 the Bible of the mini series. 1402 01:08:03,646 --> 01:08:05,681 We're going to follow the book. 1403 01:08:05,781 --> 01:08:07,550 And when in doubt, we go to the book." 1404 01:08:07,650 --> 01:08:08,851 This is what he said to me. 1405 01:08:08,951 --> 01:08:10,786 In attempting to write for television, 1406 01:08:10,886 --> 01:08:12,888 I did some ad libbing. 1407 01:08:12,988 --> 01:08:15,257 And he said, "No, go back to the book." 1408 01:08:15,357 --> 01:08:18,360 That was the first thing I learned from him, which is-- 1409 01:08:18,461 --> 01:08:20,296 it was music to my ears. 1410 01:08:20,396 --> 01:08:23,599 - And we started working on this show, which was 1411 01:08:23,699 --> 01:08:26,769 so devouring and so intense. 1412 01:08:26,869 --> 01:08:28,704 We were like rabid wolves. 1413 01:08:28,804 --> 01:08:31,307 I think we had around 300 speaking parts in 1414 01:08:31,407 --> 01:08:35,744 "Winds of War" and 2,000 extra parts and 3,000 extras 1415 01:08:35,845 --> 01:08:37,446 all in costume. 1416 01:08:37,546 --> 01:08:41,851 Dan loved difficult and very challenging 1417 01:08:41,951 --> 01:08:44,920 kind of nerve-wracking situations. 1418 01:08:45,020 --> 01:08:47,790 It was his perilous sense of drama. 1419 01:08:47,890 --> 01:08:50,226 We were insane. We shot six day weeks. 1420 01:08:50,326 --> 01:08:53,529 Six day weeks and we were looking at dailies at midnight. 1421 01:08:53,629 --> 01:08:56,866 And then you get up at 5:00 AM to go to the set. 1422 01:08:56,966 --> 01:08:59,735 And then on Sunday, we're preparing for the next week. 1423 01:08:59,835 --> 01:09:01,570 And I don't know how anybody survived. 1424 01:09:01,670 --> 01:09:02,938 - And he said, "You feel like God." 1425 01:09:03,038 --> 01:09:05,908 He said, "Here, let's do Pearl Harbor next week." 1426 01:09:06,008 --> 01:09:07,810 He said, "Turn the battleship around." 1427 01:09:07,910 --> 01:09:10,346 "Well, Mr. Curtis, it takes an hour and a half 1428 01:09:10,446 --> 01:09:11,881 to turn the battleship around." 1429 01:09:11,981 --> 01:09:13,549 "I want it facing the other direction. 1430 01:09:13,649 --> 01:09:14,950 It should be facing that direction." 1431 01:09:15,050 --> 01:09:16,652 They said, "No, no, no, sir. 1432 01:09:16,752 --> 01:09:18,420 We better shoot it facing this direction. 1433 01:09:18,521 --> 01:09:21,624 It'll-- "Turn the battleship around!" 1434 01:09:23,626 --> 01:09:28,264 - So he was king of the castle, king of the circus. 1435 01:09:28,364 --> 01:09:31,934 He was made to be some kind of-- 1436 01:09:32,034 --> 01:09:34,436 some creature like Napoleon. 1437 01:09:34,537 --> 01:09:35,838 "Onwards and upwards. 1438 01:09:35,938 --> 01:09:38,307 We'll make it through this horror show. 1439 01:09:38,407 --> 01:09:39,408 We'll do it. 1440 01:09:39,508 --> 01:09:41,410 We'll win!" 1441 01:09:42,912 --> 01:09:45,814 - Budgeted at $40 million, the "Winds of War" 1442 01:09:45,915 --> 01:09:48,384 was a historic undertaking for television. 1443 01:09:48,484 --> 01:09:50,352 And the Herculean effort paid off. 1444 01:09:50,452 --> 01:09:51,954 The mini-series attracted an audience 1445 01:09:52,054 --> 01:09:54,623 of over 140 million viewers in the U.S. alone 1446 01:09:55,724 --> 01:09:59,228 and became a resounding success worldwide. 1447 01:09:59,962 --> 01:10:02,731 - The "Winds of War" was a huge success. 1448 01:10:02,831 --> 01:10:03,999 I mean, wild. 1449 01:10:04,099 --> 01:10:07,403 It was the most dominant show of that era. 1450 01:10:07,503 --> 01:10:09,672 - It was so successful. 1451 01:10:09,772 --> 01:10:13,842 The amount of viewership and ABC was very excited. 1452 01:10:13,943 --> 01:10:16,645 - It was the toughest thing I ever had to do, 1453 01:10:16,745 --> 01:10:18,414 yet I never got tired. 1454 01:10:18,514 --> 01:10:23,719 And it was the experience of my life. 1455 01:10:23,819 --> 01:10:27,690 - I'm happy as a lark, believe me, 1456 01:10:27,790 --> 01:10:30,626 as we go rolling, rolling home. 1457 01:10:30,726 --> 01:10:32,661 - After "Winds of War," ABC asked him 1458 01:10:32,761 --> 01:10:34,897 to do "War and Remembrance." 1459 01:10:36,365 --> 01:10:38,434 It was quite an undertaking to do "Winds of War" 1460 01:10:38,534 --> 01:10:42,304 and I know a huge decision on my father's part. 1461 01:10:42,404 --> 01:10:44,907 And my mother saw that he wasn't that 1462 01:10:45,007 --> 01:10:47,476 happy after doing that big project 1463 01:10:47,576 --> 01:10:50,479 and not having something of that scope to do next. 1464 01:10:50,579 --> 01:10:52,948 And so he decided to do it. 1465 01:10:53,048 --> 01:10:55,351 The network said, "Well, why don't you 1466 01:10:55,451 --> 01:10:57,853 hire a director to do each segment?" 1467 01:10:57,953 --> 01:10:59,455 And he's like, "Are you kidding me? 1468 01:10:59,555 --> 01:11:00,756 I'm going to do them all!" 1469 01:11:03,759 --> 01:11:06,362 - And there we were in New York, starting 1470 01:11:06,462 --> 01:11:10,866 to prep "War and Remembrance" in the Plaza Hotel. 1471 01:11:10,966 --> 01:11:14,737 And Barry Diller calls up and said he's pulling the plug. 1472 01:11:14,837 --> 01:11:18,374 And I remember, I got this insane sense of elation. 1473 01:11:18,474 --> 01:11:20,009 I thought, "Thank God! 1474 01:11:20,109 --> 01:11:21,310 Save me, God. 1475 01:11:21,410 --> 01:11:22,311 Thank you. 1476 01:11:22,411 --> 01:11:23,812 They're pulling the plug. 1477 01:11:23,912 --> 01:11:25,814 I don't have to commit to this for another five years." 1478 01:11:25,914 --> 01:11:29,585 And Dan, who was a brilliant salesman, 1479 01:11:29,685 --> 01:11:32,855 spoke to Barry Diller for an hour and talked him out of it. 1480 01:11:35,724 --> 01:11:38,794 - And so a further four years of epic television production 1481 01:11:38,894 --> 01:11:41,363 in eight countries began. 1482 01:11:42,564 --> 01:11:46,669 - It was the first time anybody had ever filmed in Auschwitz. 1483 01:11:46,769 --> 01:11:48,604 And he got the approval. 1484 01:11:48,704 --> 01:11:51,407 It was a very, very emotional time, too, 1485 01:11:51,507 --> 01:11:54,043 because that was the first time ever 1486 01:11:54,143 --> 01:11:58,447 that such graphic images were portrayed 1487 01:11:58,547 --> 01:12:00,416 on TV of the Holocaust. 1488 01:12:00,516 --> 01:12:05,454 - The Emmy goes to "War and Remembrance." 1489 01:12:05,554 --> 01:12:08,691 Dan Curtis, executive producer, Barbara Steele, producer. 1490 01:12:11,660 --> 01:12:14,063 - He won the Golden Globe award. 1491 01:12:14,163 --> 01:12:15,864 He won an Emmy. 1492 01:12:15,964 --> 01:12:17,700 He was honored by the Simon Wiesenthal 1493 01:12:17,800 --> 01:12:19,568 Center with an award. 1494 01:12:19,668 --> 01:12:23,672 - It took longer than World War II, I know. 1495 01:12:23,772 --> 01:12:25,941 But I love actors. 1496 01:12:26,041 --> 01:12:28,410 And these are the greatest actors. 1497 01:12:28,510 --> 01:12:29,812 I love 'em! 1498 01:12:29,912 --> 01:12:31,480 And what they did, they brought this thing to life 1499 01:12:31,580 --> 01:12:32,681 and they made it happen. 1500 01:12:32,781 --> 01:12:35,451 - The entire two together constituted 1501 01:12:35,551 --> 01:12:36,985 34 hours of television. 1502 01:12:37,086 --> 01:12:38,520 And that will never happen again. 1503 01:12:38,620 --> 01:12:40,055 They'll never have the financing for it. 1504 01:12:40,155 --> 01:12:42,491 They'll never have a man who can do it. 1505 01:12:43,225 --> 01:12:45,828 - Spook fans and all that will think that "Trilogy" 1506 01:12:45,928 --> 01:12:47,096 was his masterpiece. 1507 01:12:47,196 --> 01:12:49,031 "Dark Shadows" was certainly a masterpiece. 1508 01:12:49,131 --> 01:12:55,003 But as a producer and everything else, 1509 01:12:55,104 --> 01:12:58,607 "Winds" and "War" went way, way above. 1510 01:12:58,707 --> 01:13:01,009 - Oh, I think this was the pinnacle of his existence. 1511 01:13:01,110 --> 01:13:04,980 It wasn't just his creative existence. 1512 01:13:05,080 --> 01:13:08,517 - Despite the enthusiastic critical reception, 1513 01:13:08,617 --> 01:13:10,619 the viewership for "War and Remembrance" 1514 01:13:10,719 --> 01:13:12,121 did not reach the record breaking 1515 01:13:12,221 --> 01:13:14,490 heights of the "Winds of War." 1516 01:13:14,590 --> 01:13:16,592 - "Bill," he said, "I can't get back to that level. 1517 01:13:16,692 --> 01:13:18,127 I don't think I'll ever get back to that level 1518 01:13:18,227 --> 01:13:20,729 again because they won't finance anything like that again. 1519 01:13:20,829 --> 01:13:23,999 I'm really frustrated because I've done these things. 1520 01:13:24,099 --> 01:13:25,868 I've gotten these great reviews from people. 1521 01:13:25,968 --> 01:13:28,437 I've gotten notices for the first time in my life 1522 01:13:28,537 --> 01:13:29,805 that I never thought I'd ever get." 1523 01:13:29,905 --> 01:13:32,574 He said, "Marvelous appreciation." 1524 01:13:32,674 --> 01:13:34,109 When he had to go back to the genre 1525 01:13:34,209 --> 01:13:38,180 again and do horror films, it was a big letdown for him. 1526 01:13:38,280 --> 01:13:40,549 - I had spent 10 years on the "Winds of War" and "War 1527 01:13:40,649 --> 01:13:41,884 and Remembrance." 1528 01:13:41,984 --> 01:13:44,820 I thought nothing would ever satisfy me again. 1529 01:13:44,920 --> 01:13:46,889 Everything seemed so paltry to me. 1530 01:13:46,989 --> 01:13:50,159 But all along, NBC had been coming to me, calling me 1531 01:13:50,259 --> 01:13:52,861 in London at weird hours. 1532 01:13:52,961 --> 01:13:54,897 They had the writers' strike. 1533 01:13:54,997 --> 01:13:56,532 They wanted to do "Dark Shadows." 1534 01:13:56,632 --> 01:13:59,535 And the last thing in the world I wanted to do 1535 01:13:59,635 --> 01:14:00,869 was "Dark Shadows." 1536 01:14:00,969 --> 01:14:04,940 I didn't want to go back into that world again. 1537 01:14:05,040 --> 01:14:07,242 I'd just had it. 1538 01:14:07,342 --> 01:14:11,146 So I said to them, "If you allow me to use the stories that I 1539 01:14:11,246 --> 01:14:13,982 used before, that might be interesting because I could do 1540 01:14:14,082 --> 01:14:16,785 it in a way that I always envisioned being able to do it 1541 01:14:16,885 --> 01:14:18,620 but couldn't." 1542 01:14:21,256 --> 01:14:24,860 - "Dark Shadows" was resurrected in 1991 with a 13 week 1543 01:14:24,960 --> 01:14:27,996 commitment on NBC in primetime. 1544 01:14:28,564 --> 01:14:32,267 Ben Cross assumed the mantle of Barnabas Collins. 1545 01:14:32,367 --> 01:14:34,603 - I, frankly, have never seen 1546 01:14:34,636 --> 01:14:36,672 one episode of the original series. 1547 01:14:36,772 --> 01:14:38,173 I asked Dan. 1548 01:14:38,273 --> 01:14:44,112 I said, "Please give me at least some of those episodes 1549 01:14:44,213 --> 01:14:45,948 so I can look at them." 1550 01:14:46,048 --> 01:14:47,583 And he said, "No, Ben. 1551 01:14:47,683 --> 01:14:48,717 You don't need it. 1552 01:14:48,817 --> 01:14:51,019 This is on another level." 1553 01:14:52,588 --> 01:14:55,290 - And I think it was, to a certain degree, 1554 01:14:55,390 --> 01:14:59,127 modernized in its approach. 1555 01:14:59,228 --> 01:15:00,863 You couldn't certainly act the way 1556 01:15:00,963 --> 01:15:05,567 they acted in the earlier ones, the early versions. 1557 01:15:05,667 --> 01:15:07,736 It was very kind of stilted but it worked for that. 1558 01:15:07,836 --> 01:15:10,906 It worked because it created a certain atmosphere. 1559 01:15:11,006 --> 01:15:12,674 This kind of opened it up. 1560 01:15:12,774 --> 01:15:17,246 And it was shot in color, of course, and shot on film. 1561 01:15:17,346 --> 01:15:19,882 - And so it lent very heavily on Dan 1562 01:15:19,982 --> 01:15:23,151 for the first, let's say, four or five episodes. 1563 01:15:23,252 --> 01:15:25,220 So it was rather lovely. 1564 01:15:25,320 --> 01:15:27,256 Each episode after that, I got to bite 1565 01:15:27,356 --> 01:15:32,628 the necks of some rather beautiful Hollywood actresses. 1566 01:15:32,728 --> 01:15:34,162 I mean, this isn't in any way-- 1567 01:15:34,263 --> 01:15:36,598 I'm not demeaning women by judging them on their sexuality 1568 01:15:36,698 --> 01:15:41,803 or not, but you cannot make a vampire show, film, series... 1569 01:15:41,904 --> 01:15:43,205 It's all about sex. 1570 01:15:43,305 --> 01:15:45,674 The undercurrent is all about sex. 1571 01:15:45,774 --> 01:15:48,143 Dan Curtis didn't say, now, the undercurrent of all this 1572 01:15:48,243 --> 01:15:49,244 is this. 1573 01:15:49,344 --> 01:15:51,313 Of course not. 1574 01:15:51,413 --> 01:15:59,855 But at the same time, there is this kind of wild aspect to it. 1575 01:15:59,955 --> 01:16:04,293 He had forces inside him that at times he literally 1576 01:16:04,393 --> 01:16:06,662 could not control. 1577 01:16:06,762 --> 01:16:09,264 So at the moment of biting someone's neck, 1578 01:16:09,364 --> 01:16:13,702 there is that feral, vicious, wild-- 1579 01:16:13,802 --> 01:16:19,007 This sort of blood fest, this need for blood. 1580 01:16:19,107 --> 01:16:21,910 But of course, it's a bit like getting drunk and making a fool 1581 01:16:22,010 --> 01:16:23,712 of yourself the night before. 1582 01:16:23,812 --> 01:16:27,049 There's this awful regret the next day when you think about, 1583 01:16:27,149 --> 01:16:29,151 perhaps, what you've done. 1584 01:16:29,251 --> 01:16:31,353 - Ben Cross was the vampire in our show. 1585 01:16:31,453 --> 01:16:33,322 And I thought he was great because he 1586 01:16:33,422 --> 01:16:35,357 looks like a medieval gargoyle. 1587 01:16:35,457 --> 01:16:38,293 He had this drawn, very intense face. 1588 01:16:38,393 --> 01:16:40,362 And I play his sort of adversary, 1589 01:16:40,462 --> 01:16:43,198 this character Julia Hoffman, this doctor 1590 01:16:43,298 --> 01:16:46,635 who's got this sort of secret in her potions 1591 01:16:46,735 --> 01:16:48,637 on how to keep him alive. 1592 01:16:48,737 --> 01:16:50,238 - We had people that were-- 1593 01:16:50,339 --> 01:16:51,907 Jean Simmons, for example. 1594 01:16:52,007 --> 01:16:55,711 I mean, iconic actress from the movies. 1595 01:16:55,811 --> 01:16:58,380 And she was playing the matriarch of the family. 1596 01:16:58,480 --> 01:17:01,717 Even Joseph Gordon Levitt was on that as a little boy. 1597 01:17:01,817 --> 01:17:03,118 Little Joey, we used to call him. 1598 01:17:03,218 --> 01:17:05,821 I mean, I worked as a director on the first two 1599 01:17:05,921 --> 01:17:07,122 and then produced the other ones. 1600 01:17:07,222 --> 01:17:09,224 I was given a lot of latitude because Dan 1601 01:17:09,324 --> 01:17:11,426 was very, very generous. 1602 01:17:11,526 --> 01:17:13,128 And I learned a lot from him, too. 1603 01:17:13,228 --> 01:17:15,330 - No one on the set worked harder than him. 1604 01:17:15,430 --> 01:17:17,866 Incredible stamina, incredible drive. 1605 01:17:20,435 --> 01:17:23,105 If he didn't like something, boy, did you know it. 1606 01:17:23,205 --> 01:17:25,674 If it was critical or it was this or it 1607 01:17:25,774 --> 01:17:27,776 came from frustration. 1608 01:17:27,876 --> 01:17:29,678 "Oh, god, I've got to get this right!" 1609 01:17:29,778 --> 01:17:32,147 And that's the kind of man he is. 1610 01:17:32,247 --> 01:17:35,384 - Dan was possessed and agitated. 1611 01:17:35,484 --> 01:17:37,919 I think he was very reluctant to go back and do 1612 01:17:38,020 --> 01:17:39,287 a "Dark Shadows" again. 1613 01:17:39,388 --> 01:17:40,689 It was very painful. 1614 01:17:40,789 --> 01:17:43,025 I actually quit in the middle of it. 1615 01:17:43,125 --> 01:17:44,292 Bang in the middle. 1616 01:17:44,393 --> 01:17:47,229 I couldn't stand the way he talked to me. 1617 01:17:47,329 --> 01:17:49,131 He was so concerned about the framing 1618 01:17:49,231 --> 01:17:50,232 of the syringe or something. 1619 01:17:50,332 --> 01:17:52,467 I couldn't stand-- and I said, "I'm out of here. 1620 01:17:52,567 --> 01:17:53,468 I quit. 1621 01:17:53,568 --> 01:17:55,037 Five weeks into shooting. 1622 01:17:55,137 --> 01:17:56,038 Recast me. 1623 01:17:56,138 --> 01:17:57,072 Reshoot everything. 1624 01:17:57,172 --> 01:17:58,073 I'm gone." 1625 01:17:58,173 --> 01:17:59,875 And the crew applauded. 1626 01:17:59,975 --> 01:18:01,276 Oh, the crew applauded! 1627 01:18:01,376 --> 01:18:02,744 I've never felt so good. 1628 01:18:02,844 --> 01:18:04,846 Then I made this wonderful exit. 1629 01:18:04,946 --> 01:18:07,983 And then, of course, I came back the next day. 1630 01:18:10,819 --> 01:18:17,125 - The end result, I thought, pictorially was wonderful. 1631 01:18:17,225 --> 01:18:19,995 - I think people were eager to see this again. 1632 01:18:20,095 --> 01:18:22,197 I mean, the people who were familiar with it certainly 1633 01:18:22,297 --> 01:18:23,865 tuned in. 1634 01:18:23,965 --> 01:18:25,434 And those who were unfamiliar with it were intrigued. 1635 01:18:25,534 --> 01:18:27,069 So you had an audience. 1636 01:18:27,169 --> 01:18:29,504 Unfortunately, what also happened historically 1637 01:18:29,604 --> 01:18:30,505 at that time was the Gulf War. 1638 01:18:34,342 --> 01:18:37,479 - The first Gulf War occurred at that time. 1639 01:18:37,579 --> 01:18:43,285 And it being the age that we are in-- were in at that time-- 1640 01:18:43,385 --> 01:18:47,189 this was like a live feed from the battlefront. 1641 01:18:47,289 --> 01:18:49,825 And it was on all the major channels. 1642 01:18:49,925 --> 01:18:54,830 And so the series, in a sense, was bumped. 1643 01:18:54,930 --> 01:18:58,834 There was no room for that kind of thing at that moment. 1644 01:18:58,934 --> 01:19:01,103 The ratings were not there for NBC 1645 01:19:01,203 --> 01:19:06,174 and we heard that NBC's not going to renew. 1646 01:19:06,274 --> 01:19:10,312 - I'm not only not ashamed that I did that series, 1647 01:19:10,345 --> 01:19:13,515 I actually consider myself very lucky and blessed 1648 01:19:13,548 --> 01:19:15,383 to be given the opportunity. 1649 01:19:18,954 --> 01:19:22,390 - While a return to Collinwood was struggling to take hold, 1650 01:19:22,491 --> 01:19:26,194 appreciation for the original series continued to grow. 1651 01:19:28,430 --> 01:19:30,565 "Dark Shadows" inspired fan conventions 1652 01:19:30,665 --> 01:19:34,069 that achieved rabid popularity. 1653 01:19:34,169 --> 01:19:37,072 And the cast embraced the burgeoning fandom 1654 01:19:37,172 --> 01:19:40,876 as the original series episodes were released on home video 1655 01:19:40,976 --> 01:19:42,110 and re-run on television. 1656 01:19:46,181 --> 01:19:49,885 - He returned in 2006 and then through 2011. 1657 01:19:49,985 --> 01:19:53,388 And now in his 80s, he wasn't in the best physical shape. 1658 01:19:53,488 --> 01:19:55,590 Why did he come back? 1659 01:19:55,690 --> 01:19:58,126 I mean, an actor is always an actor. 1660 01:19:58,226 --> 01:20:00,328 He loved the fans. 1661 01:20:01,997 --> 01:20:04,366 And he really, I think, had a desire 1662 01:20:04,466 --> 01:20:08,503 to see the fans again, to one more time glory, 1663 01:20:08,603 --> 01:20:10,539 to be there and tell them stories. 1664 01:20:10,639 --> 01:20:12,440 And so he got himself back. 1665 01:20:12,541 --> 01:20:15,110 And he loved being there again. 1666 01:20:15,210 --> 01:20:17,212 - Bravo! 1667 01:20:19,314 --> 01:20:21,883 - Physically, towards the end, it was hard, 1668 01:20:21,983 --> 01:20:24,152 but he made the effort to be there, 1669 01:20:24,252 --> 01:20:27,255 to see them again and perform for them again. 1670 01:20:27,355 --> 01:20:31,493 - I'm not suggesting, I'm telling you: don't kick ass. 1671 01:20:34,596 --> 01:20:36,164 Better that than to kiss it. 1672 01:20:41,403 --> 01:20:45,340 - Jonathan Frid passed away in 2012. 1673 01:20:45,440 --> 01:20:47,309 His final role was a cameo that year 1674 01:20:47,409 --> 01:20:51,279 in Tim Burton's reimagining of "Dark Shadows," 1675 01:20:51,379 --> 01:20:53,215 with Johnny Depp assuming the role of Barnabas. 1676 01:20:58,086 --> 01:21:00,956 - I will say there was a time when I just 1677 01:21:01,056 --> 01:21:02,624 wished "Dark Shadows" would go away, 1678 01:21:02,657 --> 01:21:05,493 just shoo, go somewhere else. 1679 01:21:05,527 --> 01:21:11,600 However, since then my feelings about the show 1680 01:21:11,633 --> 01:21:14,669 and about the people who watched the show 1681 01:21:14,769 --> 01:21:17,973 have grown exponentially. 1682 01:21:19,274 --> 01:21:22,043 - I am so proud of the fact that we are celebrating 1683 01:21:22,143 --> 01:21:23,411 our 50th anniversary. 1684 01:21:23,511 --> 01:21:24,512 It's very special to me. 1685 01:21:24,613 --> 01:21:26,014 I love all of the people that are 1686 01:21:26,114 --> 01:21:27,482 coming to help us celebrate. 1687 01:21:27,582 --> 01:21:29,484 - It's mind-boggling. 1688 01:21:29,584 --> 01:21:32,921 I mean, there are people in that audience who are grandchildren. 1689 01:21:33,021 --> 01:21:34,356 It's amazing. 1690 01:21:34,456 --> 01:21:37,559 I mean, people say, oh, God, you do "Dark Shadows"? 1691 01:21:37,659 --> 01:21:40,161 They kind of put it down and that-- 1692 01:21:40,262 --> 01:21:43,131 I'm kind of proud that we had the opportunity 1693 01:21:43,231 --> 01:21:44,266 to do what we did. 1694 01:21:44,366 --> 01:21:45,634 - And I asked some people yesterday 1695 01:21:45,734 --> 01:21:47,669 when I was signing autographs, 1696 01:21:47,769 --> 01:21:51,640 "Why do you come to this gathering?" 1697 01:21:51,740 --> 01:21:54,609 And they said, "Well, we grew up with you." 1698 01:21:54,709 --> 01:21:57,045 - And it became a big part of their childhood 1699 01:21:57,145 --> 01:21:59,547 and that's one of the reasons for the longevity of the show. 1700 01:21:59,648 --> 01:22:03,451 Because as we all had something we liked when we were kids, 1701 01:22:03,551 --> 01:22:05,253 we still remember it. 1702 01:22:05,353 --> 01:22:08,623 And for them, for that generation, 1703 01:22:08,723 --> 01:22:10,392 it was "Dark Shadows." 1704 01:22:10,492 --> 01:22:14,162 - And I think the people who find it think it's their show 1705 01:22:14,262 --> 01:22:17,699 and they love it and they make their kids watch it, 1706 01:22:17,799 --> 01:22:19,134 and then their kids love it. 1707 01:22:19,234 --> 01:22:21,236 - If you look at "Dark Shadows" now 1708 01:22:21,336 --> 01:22:26,308 and you realize that it was about characters 1709 01:22:26,408 --> 01:22:29,678 that were outsiders who were trying 1710 01:22:29,778 --> 01:22:33,214 to find their way in the world as it exists 1711 01:22:33,315 --> 01:22:35,383 and get people to understand. 1712 01:22:35,483 --> 01:22:41,990 - It's when the others became popular for a while. 1713 01:22:42,090 --> 01:22:44,359 The eccentrics. 1714 01:22:44,459 --> 01:22:47,629 You got to admit, we had a load of eccentrics. 1715 01:22:47,729 --> 01:22:49,764 And you know what was good about them? 1716 01:22:49,864 --> 01:22:52,200 The actors were just as eccentric 1717 01:22:52,300 --> 01:22:53,702 as the characters they played. 1718 01:22:53,802 --> 01:22:56,104 - We've known each other for 50 years. 1719 01:22:56,204 --> 01:23:01,443 And it's just been a real joy to know them-- 1720 01:23:01,543 --> 01:23:04,012 - Knock if off. 1721 01:23:04,112 --> 01:23:05,580 - And to deal with him. 1722 01:23:05,680 --> 01:23:07,415 He hasn't changed. 1723 01:23:07,515 --> 01:23:09,784 I knew him 50 years ago, and he's still the schmuck 1724 01:23:09,884 --> 01:23:11,386 that I knew 50 years ago. 1725 01:23:11,486 --> 01:23:15,190 - It's a treat to see how people's lives progress. 1726 01:23:15,290 --> 01:23:17,525 And it's seldom, I think, in life 1727 01:23:17,625 --> 01:23:20,395 that unless people are relatives, 1728 01:23:20,495 --> 01:23:23,732 you actually get that chance to see what's happened 1729 01:23:23,832 --> 01:23:25,600 to people after 50 years. 1730 01:23:25,700 --> 01:23:34,609 - Shadows of the night, calling me to you. 1731 01:23:34,709 --> 01:23:38,046 I've never had a moment where I wasn't 1732 01:23:38,146 --> 01:23:41,116 grateful for doing the show. 1733 01:23:41,216 --> 01:23:43,051 It meant so much. 1734 01:23:43,151 --> 01:23:46,821 And a lot of it was because of the people. 1735 01:23:47,889 --> 01:23:50,625 - He gave us all our start so we'll forever 1736 01:23:50,725 --> 01:23:52,260 be grateful to him. 1737 01:23:52,360 --> 01:23:55,163 And he was the one who okayed my writing the books. 1738 01:23:55,263 --> 01:23:58,266 So he's a powerful figure in my life. 1739 01:23:58,366 --> 01:24:00,135 I wish he were still around. 1740 01:24:03,405 --> 01:24:05,507 - Dan Curtis was flattered by the adulation 1741 01:24:05,607 --> 01:24:08,543 for "Dark Shadows" but was not one to simply dwell 1742 01:24:08,643 --> 01:24:10,378 on the past. 1743 01:24:10,478 --> 01:24:14,149 He continued working on new projects until his final days. 1744 01:24:14,249 --> 01:24:16,484 - His work ethic never diminished. 1745 01:24:16,584 --> 01:24:22,557 His love and creativity never waned his entire life up 1746 01:24:22,657 --> 01:24:25,393 until the final days. He was directing-- 1747 01:24:25,493 --> 01:24:28,196 I think he had just finished "Our Fathers" 1748 01:24:28,296 --> 01:24:30,498 very close to when he got sick. 1749 01:24:30,598 --> 01:24:32,500 - And my father was losing his strength. 1750 01:24:32,600 --> 01:24:35,670 But he had such a drive. 1751 01:24:35,770 --> 01:24:38,206 And he used to tell me, "The only reason 1752 01:24:38,306 --> 01:24:40,675 I work out as hard as I do is so that I 1753 01:24:40,775 --> 01:24:43,511 can outlive your mother." 1754 01:24:51,286 --> 01:24:55,223 - Dan passed away on March 27, 2006, 1755 01:24:55,323 --> 01:24:58,359 less than three weeks after his wife Norma. 1756 01:24:59,928 --> 01:25:02,564 - It feels very strange to be the creator of "Dark Shadows," 1757 01:25:02,664 --> 01:25:04,666 because everywhere I go, when I hear "Dark Shadows" 1758 01:25:04,766 --> 01:25:06,801 or they say, are you the guy who did "Dark Shadows"? 1759 01:25:06,901 --> 01:25:08,736 And they all have the exact same line-- 1760 01:25:08,837 --> 01:25:11,306 "I used to run home every day from school to see 1761 01:25:11,406 --> 01:25:14,542 'Dark Shadows.'" I always said, I'll probably be remembered 1762 01:25:14,642 --> 01:25:17,312 for "Dark Shadows" and not the things that I really cared 1763 01:25:17,412 --> 01:25:20,448 about, which were the great epics that I made. 1764 01:25:20,548 --> 01:25:23,451 "Dark Shadows" will be the thing that will be on my gravestone. 1765 01:25:23,551 --> 01:25:25,186 But I love "Dark Shadows." 1766 01:25:25,286 --> 01:25:28,156 I guess it's terrific to have somehow created something 1767 01:25:28,256 --> 01:25:29,891 that will live forever. 1768 01:25:29,991 --> 01:25:34,229 It's not like brain surgery, but it's... 1769 01:25:34,329 --> 01:25:36,598 Hopefully, it will live forever. 1770 01:25:37,866 --> 01:25:41,369 [music playing]